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Thread: Waste of time

  1. #21
    Panda Member pandaofthebamboo's Avatar
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    Many things aren't stated in the manga immediately. And maybe Kakshi didn't say that as well so he wouldn't confuse Naruto with to much information at once and only told him what he needed to know to complete his training.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    It wouldn't make any sense for Kagebunshins to return chakra. That means chakra is used to initiate it and then when the technique is dispelled, the chakra all comes back to the original. And now he's in the same state he was before he used it. There's no technique that chakra isn't lost in the process or some other kind of drawback. Also if it were like this, no one would be worried about overusing KB's since the chakra all comes back anyway.

  3. #23
    This Machine Pwns n00bs Amargo Deathscythe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pandaofthebamboo View Post
    I think that when the clones are dispelled the chakra is sent back to the real body or it is dispersed among all the other clones and the real one. The reason i believe so is because if it did not transfer back the enegry then why when Naruto was trying to use out all of his chakra to get the 9-tails chakra why didn't he just continuously create and dispel clones instead of fighting him self. Another reason is that if a clones changes to a frog he will this tells me that if must be the chakra going to the other bodies because if it was only the experience which turned him into a frog then the experience of of his clones should kill him, shouldn't it. This tells me that it must be the chackra going back to the bodies that change him to a frog and not the experience.
    atleast someone gets it

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  4. #24
    Panda Member pandaofthebamboo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by afro thunda View Post
    It wouldn't make any sense for Kagebunshins to return chakra. That means chakra is used to initiate it and then when the technique is dispelled, the chakra all comes back to the original. And now he's in the same state he was before he used it. There's no technique that chakra isn't lost in the process or some other kind of drawback. Also if it were like this, no one would be worried about overusing KB's since the chakra all comes back anyway.
    Well most likely a portion of chakra is used to create a clones and that is the initial chakra which is lost. And the reason why alot of people don't use it is because if they use a clones their chakra would deplete twice as fast in a battle because instead of one body using chakra to fight and do jutsus it is now 2 or more bodies using up chakra.
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  5. #25
    Assuming his clones are tougher in sage mode, he should just make one or two clones, and continually trade of during a fight. He charges up while his clone fights, then his clone charges while Naruto fights.

  6. #26
    Veteran Member escapeejm's Avatar
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    Cool

    Quote Originally Posted by afro thunda View Post
    Naruto doesn't get the chakra, only the experience/knowledge of having gathered it. He (real body) would still have to gather it himself.
    I agree with you but still if that's the case would what Pa Frog said be contradicting as well. He speaks as if the clones chakra becomes unbalance so will the chakra unbalance be transferred to Naruto.

    And, if it's just experience, then Naruto should turn into a Frog. Knowledge of experience is just that knowledge.

    Naruto should be able to use his Clones to achieve Sage Mode and more. If used correctly. But I assure you Kish will not make Naruto smart enough to think of that.

    I agree with the author of this Thread. Naruto can over come the Sage Mode stillness problem by using clones.
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  7. #27
    Panda Member pandaofthebamboo's Avatar
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    Y wouldn't Kishi make him smart enough to do that, he has done alot of other cool think with his clones which we didn't expect him to do.
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  8. #28
    Regular Member icpt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Heaven's Cloud View Post
    How are you so sure about this? Can you give me proof from the databook or manga to show that your theory is valid? Could you please explain to me too why would Pa frog tell Naruto to be careful about using kage bushin for sage mode.
    Let me break things down so you can understand...

    ------

    Let us assume that Naruto can use clones to go into multiple sage mode and transfer the natural energy to him.

    When creating a clone he will divide his chakra among those clones in the way he chooses (I don't think it has to be even, some strong clones and some weak clones might be possible.. but for easy sake lets say they are EVEN in chakra).

    Naruto = 100%
    ---> makes 3 clones that each holds 20% of his chakra, leaving his real body with 40% of his chakra.

    The situation is now:

    Naruto 40% = 0,40
    Clone A 20% = 0,2
    Clone B 20% = 0,2
    Clone C 20% = 0,2

    If all clones + naruto go into sage mode, they will increase their power by X%, let us say X = 50%

    The situation in sage looks like this now:

    Naruto 40% = 0,40 * 50% = 0,6
    Clone A 20% = 0,2 * 50% = 0,3
    Clone B 20% = 0,2 * 50% = 0,3
    Clone C 20% = 0,2 * 50% = 0,3

    Giving him a total chakra/strengt of 1,5 (or 150%) spread on 3 clones + his own body.

    If we go back and look at what his sage mode would look like if he didn't use clone technique it would be like this:

    Naruto 100% + 50% = 150%

    150% OMG!! This is the same that if his clones helped him!!

    -------------

    So again, making clones and make them go sage WILL NOT INCREASE his chackra nor give him more natural energy! I don't know how to break this down into smaller pieces or how to explain this with bananas and apples, so either you get it now, or don't.

    However, there is another aspect to kagebunshin that is strange.... his chakra will not increase, but his collective physical strength will. He might find a way to make better use of it in the future if he manages to become better at taijutsu.
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  9. #29
    Regular Member icpt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hand Banana View Post
    Someone say Bananas? Also I understood you the first time. Even though it wasn't directed at me. I doubt he'll still get it and make a what if reply.
    Can't blame me for trying to make people understand basics...
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  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by pandaofthebamboo View Post
    I think that when the clones are dispelled the chakra is sent back to the real body or it is dispersed among all the other clones and the real one. The reason i believe so is because if it did not transfer back the enegry then why when Naruto was trying to use out all of his chakra to get the 9-tails chakra why didn't he just continuously create and dispel clones instead of fighting him self. Another reason is that if a clones changes to a frog he will this tells me that if must be the chakra going to the other bodies because if it was only the experience which turned him into a frog then the experience of of his clones should kill him, shouldn't it. This tells me that it must be the chackra going back to the bodies that change him to a frog and not the experience.
    Quote Originally Posted by Amargo Deathscythe View Post
    atleast someone gets it

    Experience/memories resides in your chakra because it is your soul. You can kind of compare the kage bushin to the six paths in this case. The six paths need chakra to become animated, and shadow clones do to. You can compare the vision that the six paths share to the experience Naruto gains through his clones. The six paths all share chakra from the same source simultaneously. They don't have their own chakra reserves. If something were to happen with one of the six path's chakra, you could argue that all of them might feel it cause they have the same source of chakra or soul. Same way I think how Naruto's shadow clones work except with no chakra recievers. I stand on my theory that the shadow clones have to maintain/control their chakra in sage mode just as well as Naruto does. I believe that the reason that Naruto doesn't feel pain, or anything of that nature is because they are purely made of chakra! You don't feel pain from expending too much chakra, and chakra can't transfer pain from a clone to the main body. Pain is something you feel from your nerve system to warn you that you are in danger. Chakra or in this case a clone doesn't carry nerve receptors, and the only way Naruto could die from using clones is because he expended all his chakra reserves making them. You could argue that memories/experiences travel in your chakra, because it is your spirit aka soul.

    Turning into a frog would be chakra based, because the only way this could happen is that his or one of the clone's chakra got unbalanced

    THE BOTTOM LINE
    chakra doesn't carry pain, because nerve receptors produce pain, not a memory/experience. I never thought about something and I literally felt pain because of it.
    Experience isn't what turns him into a frog, the chakra does because they share the same chakra(this was already explained many times by many different people). Pain should be eliminated from the equation your talking about "shadow clones" and they are made up of chakra, and like I said, your nervous system produces pain, not chakra. Pain can't be in the same sentence when your talking about memories. You don't literally feel pain from memories/experience(memories can't carry nerves lol).
    Last edited by Heaven's Cloud; 10-14-2008 at 09:17 AM.

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