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  1. #41
    Senior Member janfeae's Avatar
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    What a chapter indeed. Kishimoto will forever remain my favorite author.

    I do wonder what happens though. How could she have died from that, if he said you let her die. If it was from that, it would've been murder or an accident. As for the mistranslation theories, if he said "You killed Rin" a couple of chapters back, this one would have little impact because we would've known Kakashi killed her before seeing the final page of this week's manga.

    So I do believe he meant to say, "You let Rin die."

  2. #42
    Shiniobi of the Kage Clan odramek's Avatar
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    So this could be why Obito sent the Hidden Mist in a blood bath.

  3. #43
    Senior Member thebulk's Avatar
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    The words of 'you let Rin die' really throws up alot of theories right now. Wonder if its because something got lost in translation somewhere.

    Like someone mentioned earlier, this turn of events is perfectly valid for me to understand why obito would turn the way he did. So much for all the raging and bashing earlier...this is kishi ppl...he doesnt make mistakes.

  4. #44
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    Wow, this chapter left me speechless.

    My idea behind this is that, its not a genjutsu, as i find it hard to believe someone could cast it who is on life support and with only one normal sharingan, and i don't believe it's an attempt to conceal information in rin's mind from the enemy because, as we learned in the Pain invason of Konoha arc, the leaf retrieved information from the dead body of pain, despite it being deceased.

    This is what i think happened:

    A group of high level mist ninjas surrounded Kakashi and rin, and took Rin hostage. Kakashi fights a leader of the group, and Kakashi manages to trap the lead ninja in a way he cannot move, and then attempts to use chidori on him. Just before the chidori hits, he uses a substitution jutsu on himself with Rin, so rin takes the place of him and is struck by the chidori.

    Im suggesting this because, i remember when Zabuza, at a point when he was about to be struck by Kakashi's chidori, he used Haku as a shield from it.

    What do you guys think?

  5. #45
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    1. Obito seamed surprised when he heard spiral Zetsu suit talks. He said something like "that voice". Could it be the same voice change as Goofy Toby to Bad-Ass Toby? In 603, spiral Zetsu was much like that Goofy Tobi.

    2. In the first half of 603, Spiral Zetsu was not linked to the mazou (page 1, bottom left), while on the last two pages he was. I am certain that this was not a drawing mistake.

    3. The White Zetsu speakihn from the mazou said that others were his clones. He is probably the original one, killed by Sasuke.

    4. It is hard to imagine that Obito wouldn't react screaming after seeing Kakashi killed Rin. We are probably going to see an explanation at the very beginning of 605. I believe that Obito will not reveal himself even completely enclosed by Swirl Zetsu, because Kakashi wouldn't later miss the swirl pattern of the Tobi's mask. I think that he will immediately see the set of circumstances that led Kakashi to kill Rin, and because of those, lose faith in the shinobi world and not blame Kakashi.

  6. #46
    Scanlator POW's Avatar
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    wow its already out...


    - Ha that Zetsu armor has an umbilical cord reminds me of Eva units for Evangelion

    - Love the color pages

    - Yeah this chapter shows us they are at the Mountains Graveyard which means Zetsu is the one who brought Tobi to Madara.

    - lol that final page screams "Its not what it looks like I swear...."


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  7. #47
    A while ago I saw someone say that much like how Sasuke's thematic motif is "hatred", Tobi's is "misery". I think that should be amended now to "failure". As Obito, he was a failure all his life: He failed to be on time, he failed to be a good ninja, he failed to get Rin and tell her how he felt, and he failed in being better than his rival, Kakashi. Now, he experiences the ultimate failure: The failure of his "dying" wish. The person he entrusted his "dying" with to failed to uphold it, and in probably the worse way possible: Having to actually kill the person he was entrusted to protect. Is it any wonder that Obito lost faith in the world and reality itself? Seeing it all as one big failure? Culminating in his becoming a failed version of Naruto.

  8. #48
    This chapter is very interesting because Obito was able to see through the Sharingan he gave to Kakashi. Now I'm assuming that maybe Obito was able harness this power and somehow use it to see what was going on around the Hidden Leaf Village through Kakashi's eye. Obviously Kakashi couldn't have killed Rin without cause because why would Obito be bellowing about how Kakashi "let Rin die"

  9. #49
    The Heropon! Sirxxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by janfeae View Post
    As for the mistranslation theories, if he said "You killed Rin" a couple of chapters back, this one would have little impact because we would've known Kakashi killed her before seeing the final page of this week's manga.
    +1. Kishi had to fudge the context then in order to preserve his twist this chapter. And it worked beautifully :-D

    Quote Originally Posted by mo916 View Post
    This is what i think happened:

    A group of high level mist ninjas surrounded Kakashi and rin, and took Rin hostage. Kakashi fights a leader of the group, and Kakashi manages to trap the lead ninja in a way he cannot move, and then attempts to use chidori on him. Just before the chidori hits, he uses a substitution jutsu on himself with Rin, so rin takes the place of him and is struck by the chidori.

    Im suggesting this because, i remember when Zabuza, at a point when he was about to be struck by Kakashi's chidori, he used Haku as a shield from it.

    What do you guys think?
    That's certainly possible, but it seems unlikely, considering how Kakashi was shown to react this chapter. As you can tell from all the split Tobi-Obito/Kakashi panels over the last few weeks, and the infamous "Am I Dead?" panel from the Kakashi Gaiden--Kishi hardly draws any of his artwork by accident, and you can usually get a lot of information by just looking at the illustrations.

    All that being said, I believe Kakashi would've been drawn with more of a shocked expression than he showed. We were shown his initial reaction in this chapter--and it was tears, instead of surprise. That seems to suggest he was not surprised to be doing what he did.

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  10. #50
    Senior Member knife eater's Avatar
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    I'm over the initial excitement of wondering how and why kakashi kills rin in that manner. Lots of clues but no clear direction. What gets me now, however, is what, if any, knowledge and/or experience is shared between organisms linked to the mazo. Zetsu already stated he can communicate with any number of his fellow white ones within the network. The zetsu network appears to function independently from the mazo as well.

    I noticed the balloon border for dialogue and see zetsu was complimenting another zetsu, not obito LOL!

    Why are WHITE zetsus showing association with carnivorous plants instead of trees and lotus hashirama's power normally projects? Is it the presence of uchiha power?

    Why does BLACK zetsu look EXACTLY like kushina in her "bloody habinero" mode?

    Why did obito change to an actual mask if the spirally zetsu was the original way in which he concealed his face?

    I kissed a handful of theories goodbye after this chapter but at the same time IM not disappointed with how everything is going and glad i was wrong with some predictions. kishi once again has made me worry and doubt for so long only to turn everything around and make it awesome.

    HEY! Do you guys think madara is actually truly feeble and week in his lair? I know the gedou mazo nor the outer lotus mazo have tailed beast chakra but they do have a type of chakra and madara is attached to it. Do you think he is engaged in a chakra tug of war with the mazos like a jinchuriki is with a tailed beast? What if the mazo is sapping madara's immortality instead of granting it?

    ALSO, zetsu does not need food, sleep and doesn't age. The progenitor aka "the human who knows everything" will be a similar being, created from and consisting of the same stuff madara and hashirama powers are tapped into with creation and life. Wont be so6p but someone else.
    Last edited by knife eater; 10-03-2012 at 02:38 PM.
    _____
    Obito is Tobirama's great grandson. The proof is in the pudding.

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