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  1. #21
    Senior Member Maximo's Avatar
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    Apart from the fact that Obito somehow "slipped through" the rocks there was nothing weird for me in this chapter. In fact, its one of the better flashbacks and I bet it wont end even next week.

    The most interesting part of this chapter was for me Madara. His speech about winners and loosers, about love and all that, it seemed like he really knew what he was talking about. Until now I saw him as this over-powered shinobi with heaps of confidence and greedy attitude. Seeing him in this chapter changed my previous image of Madara. Its almost as if he was the victim rather then the evil mastermind. Could it be that under that impenetrable armor he was just a big softy and romantic that was heart-broen by the sad reality of the world ?

    Obito acted like I anticipated, bit foolish but still heavily concened about his friends above all else. This just makes me even more interested in seeing how he becomes Tobi. For now I can only speculate that the reason he did not return to Konoha for so long was bcs he simply couldnt. Rehablitation of his body seems like the most likely reason behind that. This would also explain why he said "do you have any idea how long I have waited for this ?'. His growth in strenght can be explained through not just Hashirama body, but also his awakened Mangekyo and Madaras training. Although, the reason why would he want to destroy Konoha is still unclear ..

    The way I see Rins death is like this .. obviously Kakashi is not the sort of person to forget his promise and code. Im pretty sure he would protect Rin from any danger even if it would cost him his life. The only explanation for Rin to die then is for me that she herself sacrificed her life. Obito loved Rin, but Rin loved Kakashi and I think she wouldnt stand the fact of him dying to protect her. I think there was sme situation in which Kakashi and Rin were in danger, Kakashi was prepared to give his life to save Rins, but Rin just had to be a bitch and went all emo on Kakashi that she doesnt deserve that bla bla and in the end she sacrifices herself to instead save Kakashi. Obito did say something like "because you LET Rin die" instead of "because you couldnt protect Rin" as if Kakashi "decided to" and not "was unable to". The sad reality for Obito would be that despite his effortts and care for Rin, she still loved someone else and decided to give her life to that person.
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  2. #22
    Senior Member eleven11's Avatar
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    ... its hard to believe that Obito can think so clearly and roll around after having half his body crushed

  3. #23
    Senior Member Maximo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by eleven11 View Post
    ... its hard to believe that Obito can think so clearly and roll around after having half his body crushed
    Its not like Obito was crushed and 5 minutes later he wakes up in front of Madara .. It could have been days before he woke up we dont know but judging by the fact that he seemed rather energetic (granted, that could have been bcs of Hashirama doping) I would say it were few days in unconsciousness until he woke up.
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  4. #24
    The Heropon! Sirxxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    Not as exciting as I'd hoped, but that might be alright. Clearly this flashback series won't be wrapped up in just one more chapter; I'm guessing we're in for a longer (and better) set of flashbacks than we got with Kabuto.

    First of all: When Obito says "My Ancestor" Madara, does he mean as a fellow Uchiha clansman, or as a Grandfather/Great Grandfather? I'm guessing it's the boring clansman definition, but it could well be actual relation (perhaps the Izuna/Obito blood type connection will play a part, after all!).

    We already knew the Hashirama-based furniture can grow limbs, although admittedly it was more eerie seeing the fully-grown bodies hanging from branches like fruit. I wonder about he "Tobi Mask" on one of the bodies. Maybe it was just to leave Obito's eye exposed while Madara treated the damage to his face. It was cool confirming the extent Madara went to in order to stay alive so long; being rooted to a tree stump for a respirator is a very unique form of life support.

    We already knew that Madara was going to set Obito on his path through Hopeless Uchiha History rhetoric. While we've heard that line of reasoning so many times that it's really grating, at least we get to see how Obito initially reacted to it. Clearly when tragedy strikes (Rin dying, etc), Madara will swoop in having been "proven" right. I really don't get Obito's obsession with protecting Rin, though... sure he left her in Kakashi's hands before he died, but that was in the thick of combat... seriously, she's a ninja.

    It's stupid/sloppy writing that Obito "slipped through" the rocks and just happened to fall into Madara's underground lair. I'm sure a lot of fans will be upset about these absurd coincidences; I'm honestly pretty disappointed in the lack of inspiration here. How did Obito miraculously awaken his Mangekyou, which just happens to give him a Phasing type power, in the knick of time to save himself from being (totally) crushed? I'm guessing, seeing as he didn't know how to use his power, he simply slipped through the ground to Madara's tunnel (which didn't cave in despite a large-scale Earth Element technique being used, seems odd).

    I'd be relieved if Kishi addressed at least the convenient location by later revealing that Madara was behind Rin's kidnapping (for the purpose of leading Obito to that location, if Kishi can find a way for that to make sense). Kids conveniently awaken hidden powers all the time in shounen manga, but Kishi really can't expect us to believe his Main Villain was actually living directly under the exact place Obito was crushed... that's just bad writing. However, Madara DID know that Obito's sacrifice saved Kakashi/Rin, so it's likely Madara had more to do with Obito's present circumstances than he's letting on.

    It's also really dumb that Obito didn't even acknowledge his injuries or the extent to which his body had been destroyed. I'm sure to most people that would be a big deal. He's missing an arm, an eye, has a transplanted leg, and is horribly scarred all over his body. Yet his attitude is optimistic and upbeat, and all he cares about is getting back to his friends? This is strikingly unrealistic behavior, even for a shounen manga... frankly, his injuries should be causing him quite a bit of pain/trauma/shame, and would be a strong source of "Hopelessness" to get him started on his descent to evil.

    We finally confirmed that Madara literally gave Nagato his eyes. I wonder why he currently only has one eye? My theory is that it went like this:

    - Madara removes Rinnegan and transplants 2 Sharingan
    - Madara sacrifices 1 Sharingan to transplant Rinnegan into Nagato instantly via Izanagi
    - Madara is left with 1 eye, and is either unable to or (more likely) has plans in motion and simply doesn't care about the missing eye

    The question becomes: What were Madara's plans before Obito was (literally...) dropped on him? Madara can barely move, and doesn't seem to have influence over Nagato. What was the point of giving Nagato the Rinnegan if Nagato doesn't even know Madara exists (Nagato believed he awakened the Rinnegan himself, so...)? Basically, what gave Madara the power to influence the world at this point?
    Dude! Stop poking at the plot--It's going to spring a leak.

    No opinion until we get further into the flashback. The more Kishi makes Obito retain his old sense and sensibilities, the more retarded his sudden flip-the-switch to Tobi is gonna be.

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  5. #25
    Senior Member Temperjoke's Avatar
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    Interesting, at this point in time, the flower hasn't bloomed yet. I wonder if what we think of as the Gedou Mazo statue has been grown yet, since Madara refers to the flower as the Mazo. As for the chakra extending his life, that's not surprising. It's been mentioned before, with the Uzimaki clan who are blood related to the Senju clan, about people having a lot of chakra having a long life. Madara is connected to the Mazo, which probably means that it's feeding chakra into his body.

    We don't know, however, if Madara has already given his eyes to Nagato at this point, Madara only said that he's entrusted his eyes to another person. It's interesting, though, how similar Madara's beliefs about the world are to Nagato's. Nagato's solution was to make everyone suffer, or turn everyone into "losers", while Madara wants to make everyone into "winners".

  6. #26
    Mangaka Sharingan Foxhound's Avatar
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    Yeah. The far story goes more questions we have.
    Now we have one more question: why Madara has only one sharingan left and who is the former owner of that eye.
    the only things we can state:
    -It couldn't be Izuna (a pair of MS transplanted to Nagato)
    - It couldn't be Shisui (timeline factor)
    So,mysterious Uchiha? So-called Tobi?


    P.S. Also my opinion Obito's body could be also a link to his double personality...I expect so-called metanoia happens to Obito's mind.
    Last edited by Foxhound; 09-19-2012 at 03:19 PM.
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  7. #27
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    I actually liked this chapter . It was fun to see the old Obito, energetic, strong willed, putting his friends before himself... there were even jokes in this chapter .

    Looks like the moment that Nagato summoned the GM for the first time, was the moment that Madara actually died.

    Madara just implied that the current old him, can use Susanno or even Rinnegan with a pair of normal sharingans, or rather he is at a level that they will achieve their forms naturally, thus it explains how he awakened "those" eyes before death, while his previous ones were already inside Nagato... still he might have been referring to MS, seeing as Obito already used his MS jutsu... at least this explains why he only posses Susanoo and Rinnegan abilities, without his other MS jutsu. It looks like any MS that Madara implants, will turn into his own EMS eyes and Rinnegan.

    The GM is actually an over-sized Hashirama clone :O (well it does look human-like ;P), well I guess he had the capabilities to store Bijuu in himself just as the strongest of the Uzumakis.

    GM is contracted specifically to the eyes, I wonder how that actually works.



  8. #28
    Senior Member Lakritze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    I actually liked this chapter . It was fun to see the old Obito, energetic, strong willed, putting his friends before himself... there were even jokes in this chapter .

    Looks like the moment that Nagato summoned the GM for the first time, was the moment that Madara actually died.

    Madara just implied that the current old him, can use Susanno or even Rinnegan with a pair of normal sharingans, or rather he is at a level that they will achieve their forms naturally, thus it explains how he awakened "those" eyes before death, while his previous ones were already inside Nagato... still he might have been referring to MS, seeing as Obito already used his MS jutsu... at least this explains why he only posses Susanoo and Rinnegan abilities, without his other MS jutsu. It looks like any MS that Madara implants, will turn into his own EMS eyes and Rinnegan.

    The GM is actually an over-sized Hashirama clone :O (well it does look human-like ;P), well I guess he had the capabilities to store Bijuu in himself just as the strongest of the Uzumakis.

    GM is contracted specifically to the eyes, I wonder how that actually works.
    Quote Originally Posted by Lakritze View Post
    Maybe it's just me, but Kishi is really pushing this "Hashirama-DNA-Clone-Thing" a bit too far:

    • It gives you longlivety and more stamina.
    • It supposedly makes the MS/EMS (we don't know for certain) develop into a Rinnegan.
    • It (for whatever reason) improves Shisui's and certainly also other sharingans.
    • There is a good chance Hashirama's DNA prevents the Mangekyou from deteriorating (That's at least my bet why Obito hadn't turned blind already.).
    • Zetsu seems to be a strange Hashirama-Clone-Composition, yet: If he really is, how could Yamato's DNA improve the Zetsu-clones? That seems a bit weird.
    • Don't forget that Yamato already has Hashirama-DNA, which gives him access to certain jutsus (Mokuton and Kyuubi-control for example). Am I the only one who is wondering why Yamato isn't way stronger? If Hashi-DNA has such an enormous potential, why are his chakra-reserves on Kakashi's level?

    Ok, add the GM being a Hashi-Clone to my list.

  9. #29
    shiro merciless's Avatar
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    what i dont get is how madara was revived with edo tensei in that state, at the time he was alive he looks old and half dead... hopefully we get some revelation about this

  10. #30
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    I actually liked this chapter . It was fun to see the old Obito, energetic, strong willed, putting his friends before himself... there were even jokes in this chapter .

    Looks like the moment that Nagato summoned the GM for the first time, was the moment that Madara actually died.

    Madara just implied that the current old him, can use Susanno or even Rinnegan with a pair of normal sharingans, or rather he is at a level that they will achieve their forms naturally, thus it explains how he awakened "those" eyes before death, while his previous ones were already inside Nagato... still he might have been referring to MS, seeing as Obito already used his MS jutsu... at least this explains why he only posses Susanoo and Rinnegan abilities, without his other MS jutsu. It looks like any MS that Madara implants, will turn into his own EMS eyes and Rinnegan.

    The GM is actually an over-sized Hashirama clone :O (well it does look human-like ;P), well I guess he had the capabilities to store Bijuu in himself just as the strongest of the Uzumakis.

    GM is contracted specifically to the eyes, I wonder how that actually works.
    I don't think Madara was talking about being able to awaken the Rinnegan or anything like that with his current eyes... I think he just meant that one cannot achieve the true power of the MS (Susano'o among other things) without both eyes. For instance, the current Obito is handicapped because he lacks the eye he gave to Kakashi (and perhaps also handicapped in his use of the Rinnegan since he only implanted one).

    Good analysis of the Gedo Mazou being an oversized Hashirama clone! That's actually really interesting. I wonder if he was capable of creating such a clone on his own in life, perhaps to combat Madara's Susano'o? It's been stated that Hashirama handed out the Bijuu to other nations... perhaps now we know how he stored them.

    Also interesting that Madara may well have died when Nagato first summoned Gedo Mazou. Time to go re-read that chapter for hints! Not expecting huge hints, but you never know.

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