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  1. #31
    Senior Member Lakritze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    Hopefully next chapter they wise up and attack the Mazou. Also, I'd like to see Naruto lend chakra to Kakashi like Tsunade lends chakra to Oonoki. And integrating Sage Mode into the offensive could be interesting; as others have predicted, perhaps the extended reach of Natural Energy could catch Tobi by surprise. So many possibilities; simple Taijutsu won't work, and neither will Kamui.
    You know, I always wondered whether Guy and Kakashi got their chakra replenished when they took a bath in Narurama's chakra.

  2. #32
    Senior Member Lakritze's Avatar
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    Konan?

    Quote Originally Posted by knife eater View Post
    Do any of you also agree then that kakashi, with his encountering tobi on multiple occasions before, with his sharingan and supplimentd insight, do you not agree that he should have reached the same or similar conclusion as konan? All she had to do was observe and count.
    Kakashi observed the same stuff already so why are they telling themselves no big moves when konan went straight to BIG MOVE and defeated the ability that they are still currently trying to cope with. Konan forced tobi into izanagi, that in itself kinda makes chumps out of kakashi, gai, and naruto..

    Kakashi needs to sustain kamui by at least the maximum duration of a tobi phase to connect it. Its much easier to allow naruto and the two remaining beasts sustain large area attacks long enough to force materialization in the area or out of area and into a predicted counter.

    I just hope that with the kunai and flying debris; kakashi finally saw past tobi's timing.
    You gotta to be kidding! Konan? After years of observing, she came up with a one-hit-plan, and after it failed, she got beaten up by a one armed Taijutsu-fighter. And, by the way, her jutsu involved explosion-tags, that don't even rely on the user's chakra. If there ever was a weak Akatsuki-member, it was Konan. Don't forget that Guy and Kakashi held their ground against a few Bijuus.

    The logic of Naruto-fights is always the same: At first, you watch them and don't have any clue how to beat them. The best example is the fight between Danzou and Sasuke. And we know how it ended.

    If I may offer an alternative interpretation of the last chapter: With exception of Kakashi, they used hardly any chakra. Especially Guy is an impressive and extremely effective fighter, and I am beginning to see how he became Kakashi's main rival. And all six of them (never forget Gyuki and Kurama) were watching Tobi carefully. And you are forgetting one thing: Minato didn't win against Tobi with his speed, but with his Flying Thunder God technique. Once Minato placed the seal on his opponent, Tobi was pretty much doomed. And the FTG can't be predicted by the Sharingan.

    I have one question for our experts: What purpose does Tobi's Rinnegan serve? The six bodies are gone, and without them, the advantages of the Rinnegan are rendered useless.

  3. #33
    Master of Bludging ChaosMaster's Avatar
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    Konan had all the time to observe and learn of Tobi's abilities and weakness. While Kakashi has encountered Tobi a few times, their encounters were a lot shorter, and have never forced Tobi to use his technique continuously for 5 (or was it 10) mins straight. I reckon Tobi's rinnegan still has the power of the 6 paths, however he hasn't used them yet because they most likely won't serve much benifit to him, especially since his more experienced with the sharingan.

  4. #34
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakritze View Post
    ............. What purpose does Tobi's Rinnegan serve? The six bodies are gone, and without them, the advantages of the Rinnegan are rendered useless.
    As we saw with Madara and Edo Nagato, the Rinnegan user does not need paths. I can only assume that Tobi either Can't use Rinnegan powers while having only one active, Or he just prefers to use his Sharingan instead.

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  5. #35
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    As we saw with Madara and Edo Nagato, the Rinnegan user does not need paths. I can only assume that Tobi either Can't use Rinnegan powers while having only one active, Or he just prefers to use his Sharingan instead.
    I can't believe someone would consider the Rinnegan to be useless without Paths!

    Tobi has stated that he can use Human Realm's power back when Kabuto captured Yamato, but he has yet to actually use it. I wonder if certain Rinnegan abilities manifest themselves in each eye?

    It's also possible he needs to think about conserving his chakra, and his warping power is all he needs to either win the fight or stall for time while his Juubi is completed. That was one of the reasons that Guy suggested Tobi was holding back from having his Paths use Rinnegan powers, because supposedly the Good Guys know those abilities and how to counter them... personally, I think the overwhelming power of those abilities are almost beyond countering, or at the very least require more chakra to counter than they do to perform, but there you have it.

  6. #36
    Senior Member knife eater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakritze View Post
    You gotta to be kidding! Konan? After years of observing, she came up with a one-hit-plan, and after it failed, she got beaten up by a one armed Taijutsu-fighter. And, by the way, her jutsu involved explosion-tags, that don't even rely on the user's chakra. If there ever was a weak Akatsuki-member, it was Konan. Don't forget that Guy and Kakashi held their ground against a few Bijuus.

    The logic of Naruto-fights is always the same: At first, you watch them and don't have any clue how to beat them. The best example is the fight between Danzou and Sasuke. And we know how it ended.

    If I may offer an alternative interpretation of the last chapter: With exception of Kakashi, they used hardly any chakra. Especially Guy is an impressive and extremely effective fighter, and I am beginning to see how he became Kakashi's main rival. And all six of them (never forget Gyuki and Kurama) were watching Tobi carefully. And you are forgetting one thing: Minato didn't win against Tobi with his speed, but with his Flying Thunder God technique. Once Minato placed the seal on his opponent, Tobi was pretty much doomed. And the FTG can't be predicted by the Sharingan.

    I have one question for our experts: What purpose does Tobi's Rinnegan serve? The six bodies are gone, and without them, the advantages of the Rinnegan are rendered useless.
    Yes and no. I reread chapters 509 and 510. What was the likelihood of konan ever being present to see tobi phase for 5 minutes straight? The details she mentions except for one (5 min) should be immediately noticeable to kakashi, especially if seen with his sharingan. True, konan had years of opportunity to observe tobi but the issue of exploiting drawbacks to tobi's ability does not take years. How long did it take to realize the timetable for pein pulling and repelling? Not years.

    Ill go a little further. Kakashi had seen tobi both phase and warp. At the very least he should notice that tobi is briefly solid when warping himself. That detail should have influenced their combat approach in the beginning and taijitsu is hardly going to threaten tobi to the point of warping himself. BTW, konan did spend chakra setting off the billions of explosive tags.
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  7. #37
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    The details aren't easily noticeable. Look at Tobi and tell me how you can tell when he is or isn't using his phasing ability if he's just standing there. All they know is Tobi has to be solid in order to initiate any kind of attack. Kakashi doesn't need his Sharingan to figure that out. And that if he touches them, it's game over. That's why they're all aiming for counterattacks. They're not using big attacks because if he's just gonna phase through them all, they're just wasting chakra.

  8. #38
    Ah crap... gave it one. Should have given two because Guy is the man. Rest of it was complete and utter [...].
    Tune in the next week when Naruto awakens Super Uzumaki Mode 2 where his hair will go black! Because everyone knows that Uchiha are the ultimate hax and black hair is their trait, so Naruto will have black hair as well. Tobi takes off his mask to reveal that he is Obito in Kushina's body and uses hair attack on Naruto who is saved by Sasuke who then combines with him into Sasruto.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Lakritze's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by knife eater View Post
    Yes and no. I reread chapters 509 and 510. What was the likelihood of konan ever being present to see tobi phase for 5 minutes straight? The details she mentions except for one (5 min) should be immediately noticeable to kakashi, especially if seen with his sharingan. True, konan had years of opportunity to observe tobi but the issue of exploiting drawbacks to tobi's ability does not take years. How long did it take to realize the timetable for pein pulling and repelling? Not years.

    Ill go a little further. Kakashi had seen tobi both phase and warp. At the very least he should notice that tobi is briefly solid when warping himself. That detail should have influenced their combat approach in the beginning and taijitsu is hardly going to threaten tobi to the point of warping himself. BTW, konan did spend chakra setting off the billions of explosive tags.
    If it were so easy to take Tobi down, then why didn't Itachi do it? And why does everybody think that Kakashi's Sharingan is able to see through Tobi's technique? No eye-technique - not the Byakugan, not the Mangekyou, and certainly no ordinary Sharingan - is able to tell shadow-clones and the original body apart. And Nagato obeyed to Tobi, so we can assume that Nagato wasn't able to dismantle Tobi's jutsu by just observing it.

    I don't want to hype Tobi, but expecting Kakashi to see through his technique just because of his Sharingan seems a bit too far-fetched. However, I am sure Tobi will be beaten or at least forced to retreat. Naruto is able to dodge his movements, and more importantly: Tobi is rather weak when it comes to offense. All he does is warping shinobi away. But beyond that, I don't remember him using his own power. He rather relies on other - admittedly extremely powerful - "tools": Rinnegan's six paths, Gedo Mazou, Sasuke. I don't recall him using any attack-jutsus.

  10. #40
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afro Thunda View Post
    The details aren't easily noticeable. Look at Tobi and tell me how you can tell when he is or isn't using his phasing ability if he's just standing there. All they know is Tobi has to be solid in order to initiate any kind of attack. Kakashi doesn't need his Sharingan to figure that out. And that if he touches them, it's game over. That's why they're all aiming for counterattacks. They're not using big attacks because if he's just gonna phase through them all, they're just wasting chakra.
    If Tobi Touches a person he can suck them into some place, and I now believe that sometimes he sucks people into another dimension, although this is not always the case.

    Here is an Interesting point. What if a person has a Reverse summoning Tatoo, or they can use Hirashin like Yondaime. Then, assuming they remain alive and conscious in the place they were sucked to, Should they not be able to reverse summon themselves back?

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