PAST [cross] FUTURE: Senju Hashirama x Naruto Uzumaki

[psukkar]

"But if the current generation will always surpass the one before, then how would he stand up to his own second coming - Uzumaki Naruto."

this was never set in stone, not all new is better than the old.


I always expected the old would be better than the new as they were in times of constant war where powerful techniques were in high demand for SURIVIAL.

Just like in real wars the technology developed during then is far more impressive than in peace times. Most of the technology we use today comes from the advancements made for world war 2 and 1.

Moral of the story is; if need something really bad your forced to get it. Especially if your surival is in stake.

The infarmous phrase said by kahashi to Kakuzu was in regards to the wind rasengan. And the wind rasengan is the only jutsu we have seen in this time era of the narutoverse that is truely powerful and new.

Naruto will surpass the old powerhouses that try to copy the sage of 6 paths like madara, tobi and even hasihrama. Naruto making a new technique that is very powerful is proof of that. He also has sage mode something that will prove to be ace in the hole as the enemy hasnt understood how it works and what it does or how powerful it really is.

That being said just because naruto has the making of surpassing the so6p heir that doesnt mean everyone else in naruto's era can surpass their respective elders. The so6p was once in a lifetime and so is naruto by the look of things.

Once again guys; Hashirama is strong, we know that.

- But even Hashirama would've lost against Minato, for example.

Hashirama and Madara were perfectly matched out to each other, if it comes to jutus's / power. The biggest differences between them, is the WILL OF FIRE.
Madara Uchiha always fought for POWER, for his own needs.. Hashirama fought WITH LOVE, for the ones he needed to save and protect. That power, Will of Fire, is something that comes from a pure heart..a power that will give you a BOOST and overwhelm your opponent with.

I've been saying this from the beginning; the reason why Madara is using Hashirama's power this much, is because Kishimoto wants to show us, what 1st. Hokage was really made off. We haven't SEEN what Madara can do, with his evil powers. Kishimoto shows us through Madara, what Hashirama could in do his prime and what he was all capable off.

DONT UNDERESTIMATE MADARA'S POWER, just because he didn't had the Mokuton. Remember that they fought each other MANY TIMES before and they all ended with a draw; their battle at the VOTE was a different one: Madara Uchiha knew that they were equal in power and his change of winning was very low; even with the Kyuubi next to him. So his MASTERPLAN was extracting DNA from him, so he went all out and fooled him and the shinobi world, that he was dead.

Hashirama won the fight, but the battle still goes on.. and that battle is still Madara's hatred vs. Will of Fire.

That means that Edo Madara is going to have a bigger role later on,.. we will see more of Madara Uchiha, because he is the LAST VILLAIN, and not Sasuke.

do still think that even after madara's admission?

I think alot guys assume madara fought hasihrama in a lot of 1v 1 situtions but in times of war this rarily the case. The shinobi world though hasihrama was the best, the fire counrty though this and made hokage.

I doubt given how powerful hasihrama's techs are i doubt you would be able to face him solo hence madara used the fox in the only 1v1 situtaion we know of that they fought in. Not saying there werent others but whats excatly said in the manga is that senju and the uchiha fought. I doubt they fought 1v1s alot.

"But even Hashirama would've lost against Minato"

doubtful minato's weakness is attack options if you tank the rasengan he has problems. Hasihrama given his healing and chakra reserves would take minato no problem. remember hasihrama was talking on the fox so he can handle a rasengan.

Not saying minato would die either as he could just simply run away with his timespace jutsu but thats not really a fight anymore is it.

[POW]

Actually no Kakashi words about the next generation surpassing the previous was meant to be a general statement not taken so literal. The point is that eventually the next generation shall surpass the previous it doesnt mean every generation that follows automatically will surpass the previous.

The idea is that the previous generation will pass on their knowledge and then eventually someone will coming along and take it further. This is what is called a legacy left to the next generation and what Shikamaru mentioned to Naruto after he got depressed that one day he would have to be the one leaving things to be inherited.


This can be seen in Naruto Taking the Rasengan and Sage mode further than Minato and Jiraiya. It can also be seen in Orochimaru and Kabuto mastering Edo tensei to higher degree than Tobirama.

[Zero]

People should keep in mind that all that all this Hashirama glorifying is coming from Kabuto and Edo Madara. Think about that for minute.... Remember Orchimaru's & Jiraya's conversation back in part 1 during the sannin fight.











How they define strength is completely different!


Edo Madara/ Kabuto / Orchimaru = Ability is what true strength is and this is heard even in Madara's comment "strength is a real tangible thing".


Hashirama/ Tsuande/ Hiruzen = True strength comes from within, from ones "will".



This is why people are confusing Edo Madara's comments about Hashirama being the greatest shinobi since the Sage of the 6 Paths etc. and taking it literally. Its just an opinion and in that regard consider the source !!!

You do realize that you have hyped Hashirama even more than he is ? You just said that from ability point of few, Hashirama was the strongest and to this day seems to be the strongest ninja (beside So6p), but the will is an important factor as well, but wait, Hashirama was the creator of the term, will of fire, so he certainly had a great amount of will fire. The truth is, without the will of fire, Madara will never be able to show use what Hashirama was truly capable of.


Hmmmm, so where is the person that once proposed another explanation to

the current generation will always surpass the one before

? That it wasn't meant in power, but in time, that the old generation will be surpassed by new, since the old will eventually die out. Even Tobi (posing as Madara) said that he surpassed Hashirama, because he is still alive and now we know that Hashirama was stronger than Madara, not to mention that beside Hashirama, the strongest ninja ever, is still the first ninja.

[almara]

@psukkar

you cant really use that analogy about technology here becoz it doesnt really work like that in the narutoverse as the soldiers havent gotten better at shooting their guns since the evolved technology as being able to shoot well in the old times using muskets is arguably much harder than today but at the same time the precision of todays weapons have improved, making the soldiers more deadly.

i agree with you psukkar that i think naruto will surpass the previous powerhouses of hashirama and madara and i would go as far as saying the SO6P, naruto certainly has the potential to achieve the same things that the SO6P had in terms of power but he will also surpass the SO6P in achieving a lasting peace.

come to think about it, what if naruto's way to achieve permanent peace was to implement a less invasive version the moon eye plan that would be quite a twist, but highly unlikely.

[Sirxxx]

ATM Naruto is outgunned.

Where you there when he fended off 5 OF THE 9 TAILED BEASTS SIMULTANESOULY?! I doubt even Susanoo could've held up against all those Bijuu blasts from every direction like Naruto did.

People should keep in mind that all that all this Hashirama glorifying is coming from Kabuto and Edo Madara. Think about that for minute....
How they define strength is completely different!

Its just an opinion and in that regard consider the source !!!

Yeah, but it's BECAUSE Kabuto and Madara see "strength = power/techniques" that their praise makes Hashirama all the more formiddable. Who better to judge how much power one man can produce than someone who covets/craves/clings to power?

doubtful minato's weakness is attack options if you tank the rasengan he has problems. Hasihrama given his healing and chakra reserves would take minato no problem. remember hasihrama was talking on the fox so he can handle a rasengan

Only if the 1st and 4th have a long, drawn-out battle; then the advantage is definitely with Hashirama. The 4th is more of a speed/precision specialist--One well-placed kunai to the heart/head is all he would need. One can't heal from a one-hit kill attack, because he'd be too one-hit kill'd.

That being said just because naruto has the making of surpassing the so6p heir that doesnt mean everyone else in naruto's era can surpass their respective elders. The so6p was once in a lifetime and so is naruto by the look of things.

Well, yeah, no one's expecting Ino to suddenly become capable of taking on Madara any time soon, even if she had 30 generations to prepare. I was gonna say more, but POW did a better job:

Actually no Kakashi words about the next generation surpassing the previous was meant to be a general statement not taken so literal. The point is that eventually the next generation shall surpass the previous it doesnt mean every generation that follows automatically will surpass the previous.

The idea is that the previous generation will pass on their knowledge and then eventually someone will coming along and take it further. This is what is called a legacy left to the next generation and what Shikamaru mentioned to Naruto after he got depressed that one day he would have to be the one leaving things to be inherited.


This can be seen in Naruto Taking the Rasengan and Sage mode further than Minato and Jiraiya. It can also be seen in Orochimaru and Kabuto mastering Edo tensei to higher degree than Tobirama.

@psukkar
come to think about it, what if naruto's way to achieve permanent peace was to implement a less invasive version the moon eye plan that would be quite a twist, but highly unlikely.

Then he would have betrayed the SO6P, Jaraiya, Minato, Kushina, Konan, Yahiko, Nagato, Raikage, and 8 of the tailed beasts. There are just too many people who have passed on, too many dreams that are sputtering to stay alight, too many future generations' survivals that are riding on Naruto's fulfilling his mission.

[Rlinfamous]

Actually no Kakashi words about the next generation surpassing the previous was meant to be a general statement not taken so literal. The point is that eventually the next generation shall surpass the previous it doesnt mean every generation that follows automatically will surpass the previous.

The idea is that the previous generation will pass on their knowledge and then eventually someone will coming along and take it further. This is what is called a legacy left to the next generation and what Shikamaru mentioned to Naruto after he got depressed that one day he would have to be the one leaving things to be inherited.


This can be seen in Naruto Taking the Rasengan and Sage mode further than Minato and Jiraiya. It can also be seen in Orochimaru and Kabuto mastering Edo tensei to higher degree than Tobirama.

I take Kakashi's words even less literally. To me, they only refer to the next generation replacing the previous and coming into their own. The context is Kakashi, who has just been surpassed in power by his student, talking to Kakuzu, who has just been defeated by kids even though he used a forbidden jutsu to extend his life by stealing the lives of others. Kakuzu is a perfect example of the old terrorizing the young and not allowing them to come into their own. Orochimaru, Tobi and Madara are also excellent examples. Compare these to heroes such as the Hokages, Itachi, or Kakashi, who sacrificed themselves to protect the weak. It fits perfectly with what Shikamaru learned while battling the "immortals", that the King in the village that must be protected is the younger generations who will carry on the Will of Fire.

[almara]

Then he would have betrayed the SO6P, Jaraiya, Minato, Kushina, Konan, Yahiko, Nagato, Raikage, and 8 of the tailed beasts. There are just too many people who have passed on, too many dreams that are sputtering to stay alight, too many future generations' survivals that are riding on Naruto's fulfilling his mission.

that entirely depends on how invasive naruto would be, if he chooses only interfere when there is about to be war, then it isnt really a bad thing but yeah, it is a hollow peace as it is something that is forced upon them and isnt achieved bythenselves like gaara said in the manga.

[Zero_Nero]

I tried to come up with an version of a fight where Naruto Wins against Hashirama in a fight and... I just dont see it. Naruto, while very powerful, he probably pales in comparisons to Hashirama in terms of power, skills, and overall ability, Naruto would be able to keep up.... Unless Naruto gains Rinnegan :O

[Kabow]

If Naruto abuses Kurama and his shadow clones he's pretty much invincible. I said this before, but Naruto with an almost unlimited amount of chakra can create clones to fight for him while he's far away from harm. For example, he can just stay in another country (or the other side of the planet) and keep on sending 10,000 clones to suicide with something.

[bankai]

While that is a theme within the series, I think Naruto will probably suppress him if only for one reason... he is the Main character

HAHAHAHAHAAHAHA everyone know sasuke is the main character