Naruto 577 Discussion / 578 Predictions

[paulbee]

Nagato's "parents" may not even be his parents at all, and/or his memories before Konan and Yahiko could even have been falsely planted.

[almara]

Tobi lies in general.. but you're sayin that he lies all the time, so we mustn't trust him for what he says! I agree with you that we can't trust TOBI --> that's obvious, but try to understand, that sometimes you don't NEED to lie or manipulate.. because he won't benefit from it. Their are no results that would give him the upperhand later on.
Tobi was going to capture Konan ( asking where Nagato is and kill her afterwards ), so why would he even bother lying or manipulating her with information like; I CREATED AKATSUKI AND I GAVE THOSE EYES, if he knew that she was gonna die? Tobi wouldn't benefit at all!

Tobi said it, because A. Kishimoto tells us through Tobi, that Tobi created Akatsuki, he gave those eyes, he then tells us the background story about the Rinnegan / elder - young son / spiritual - physical energy / Izanagi etc.. and B. it gave us more clarification why Tobi said to Zetzu in the woods about: that Rinne Tensei was supposed to be used on me etc.

Go to this link: http://i1000.mangareader.net/naruto/...to-1485943.jpg

" He might as well enlight her, because she's gonna die anyway ".. Tobi confronted her for Nagato's eyes and she's was going to get killed anyways, so again: why would you lie or try to manipulate her? We know that he had control over 4th Mizukage, he asked then to Kisame to join his clan and the list goes on and on.

Tobi says to her at the next page; " you were a foolish little girl who KNEW nothing.. " that's because he lied and manipulated her and Nagato all these time, and now he came clean, because he won't have any use of her anymore. Her days are over and the only thing he wanted, was to hear where Nagato was.

Click: http://i1000.mangareader.net/naruto/...to-1490028.jpg

can you see the build up? Tobi vs. Konan was also for us, to know more about Tobi's plans, history of shinobi world, his techiques ( his weaknesses about his wharping technique ), Juubi, his fight against Hashirama as main goal: extracting DNA, him telling that THERE'S NO HOPE OR PEACE etc.

Re-read the chapter and if you don't understand what I mean now, I seriously don't know how to explain myself to you.

** Minato can do so much better and faster? Just a little taste example; just look what itachi recently did against Nagato.. and that's really a tiny little thing compared with what he done before. If that's not fast analyzing skills and effectively executed, well bro: then I don't know it anymore. I would love to bring the other scenarios of Itachi.. but don't want to act like a fanboy

i understand your arguements but my points still stands, you say tobi doesnt have a reason to lie to konan but he still does that wont change, if you cant see that a mental attack on konan would help tobi a great deal then i dont really see the point of you keep commenting on what i write, when you start out by disagreeing what i write and then shortly after is actually making arguements for tobi lying, some consistency would be nice. believe it our not(due to your questionable comprehension of what i write, putting words in my mouth) im not saying that tobi lies all the time, im saying that he most often lies when it comes to ppl that he doesnt completely trust, as that is when he has a reason to so, for example if it was kisame he said things to, then i would have believed him, but he said these things to an enemy, so it stands to reason that he is lying. also the sentence you wrote about konan "you were a foolish little girl who KNEW nothing.." could also be understood as tobi was lying to konan that she didnt know anything in life nor when she died.

except minato have analyzed situations perfectly with a lot less info, for example he understood tobi's identity and plan as soon as he was face to face to him, he made a plan for naruto and saw it through while fighting tobi and the kyubi, if those things dont surpass anything itachi did(considering his actual success) then you really are a fanboi and any arguement i come up with, no matter how valid and superior example, wont be enough.

[Aga bomBa]

Bro,.. which mental attack are ya talkin about m8? Which attack on Konan would help Tobi a great deal?

- He wanted to know where Nagato was for takin out the eyes.. that's it.

For which reason, would Tobi make a mental attack.. what would benefit him in the end?? Nothing, simple nothing. She's going to die, no matter what. There's no use for her anymore + probably the reason why she was alive all these time, was because of Nagato. Her influences in the Akatsuki Clan was nothing, compared to the others.

1. Tobi lies / manipulates like a Motherfucker..
2. The latest chapters showed us, that Tobi doesn't have emotions / feelings, he couldn't comprehend the feeling he got from Naruto, when he got all those names from the Bijuu's. Everything is a mindplay for him and he seeks only for the hatred inside of people.

Example; Tobi would be throwing his own glasses, if he had lied to Sasuke. Tobi knew that Itachi told him lets say 3/4 of the story, so the best thing for him to do; is telling him the truth for lets say 90%. This way, Sasuke will listen to him, because he tells exactly what Sasuke already heared from others,.. but by telling the truth to him: he clarifies the story as LEGIT. This way: Sasuke boils up with anger and the result is Sasuke's HATRED towards the people who fucked up his brother's life.

Tobi would've lost Sasuke, if he didn't told him the truth.. but by even telling him the truth, he still manipulates the situation to his own benefit. His lies about the second kyuubi attack + taking his brother's eyes yes or no, is nothing compared to the truth that Sasuke heared about his brother Itachi.

3. You only lie or manipulate, if you can benefit from it.

In this particular sitation with Konan.. once again; there was no need ( IMO ) for him to lie or even manipulate her. A mental attack, as you speak off, didn't even happened if you ask me. Telling her that he created akatsuki + gaving those eyes to Nagato, isn't a mental attack at all; what Tobi did with Sasuke, was a metal attack.

Lets say that Tobi's intention was a mental attack; in what way would that result be useful for him or even be different then not TRYING to execute a mental attack on her? Tobi came to hear where Nagato was, so he could take his eyes. Do you really think that Tobi thought that, if I tell her that I was the one who created Akatsuki and gave those eyes to Nagato,.. she will simple be overwhelmed with the information and NOW, she will give me the location of Nagato without breaking out a fight? Tobi even underestimated her power.. if Konan had somekind of power that Tobi was afraid off, then I can understand why he would try to execute such mental attack or anything related to that, but that wasn't the case.

I've said that I pair Minato and Tobi among Itachi's analyzing skills.. all of their situtations were different, but these three are the best in what they're doing.

[almara]

so some1 like tobi wouldnt use a mental attack on konan to anger her or give her a sense of hopelessness and futility, seems perfectly normal modus operendi for some1 like tobi, why you cant see it, is beyond me.

[pratesh]

Nagato's "parents" may not even be his parents at all, and/or his memories before Konan and Yahiko could even have been falsely planted.

I like where this is going. In fact, I'll go further and say that the reason Nagato awakened the Rinnegan might be because Tobi hit him with a genjutsu. This genjutsu would be similar to the one Itachi used against Kakashi, except it would simply aim to cause emotional distress.

In an age of war, I can't see that only one Uzumaki experienced enough pain to awaken the eyes. I feel he was hit with a high level genjutsu and was(unknown to him) tortured to the point necessary to awaken.

[lunchroomclassic]

I like where this is going. In fact, I'll go further and say that the reason Nagato awakened the Rinnegan might be because Tobi hit him with a genjutsu. This genjutsu would be similar to the one Itachi used against Kakashi, except it would simply aim to cause emotional distress.

In an age of war, I can't see that only one Uzumaki experienced enough pain to awaken the eyes. I feel he was hit with a high level genjutsu and was(unknown to him) tortured to the point necessary to awaken.

I'm definitely a subscriber to the genjutsu theory the night Nagato awakened his eyes. His entire life prior might have been a complete genjutsu. It seemed Nagato wasn't even aware that he was an Uzumaki, I think he would've at least mentioned it to Naruto before his death, or even when he came back via Edo Tensei.