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Thread: Pein's identity

  1. #1
    FoxHound CrimsonFox's Avatar
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    Naruto Pein's identity

    I know this discussion has occured before, but now there is a bit more proof and info to back this theory up. Before I begin, let me first say that I did not believe this until today. I believe that Pein is really Minato, the 4th hokage. The manga thus far has provided more details and facts to support this claim.

    1. It was stated that the 4th only sealed half the 9 tails, the light half, in his son, Naruto. Where did the other half get sealed? I believe that due to the fact that the 4th was aware of his power and ability, he felt that he would be able to control the dark half of the 9 tails, and sealed the other half in himself. This could be why the 4th no longer has love for his sensei. The dark power of the kyuubi has destroyed all traces of his emotion.

    2. If you look at Pein's new body, it does in fact resemble Deidra. With the piercings, removed, use your imagination, it clearly is a likeness of Deidra. Now, whether or not this is Deidra's actual body, or some clone is up for grabs. But, the point I am getting to is that Pein's initial appearence can also be said to resemble Minato, the 4th.

    3. The 4th hokage was known as konoha's yellow flash due to the fact that he created a jutsu that enabled him to travel great distance in a small matter of time, and also because he is a straight up badass. This is not opinion since it was stated that a "flee on site" order was given during the third ninja war when in the presence of the 'Yellow Flash'. Pein has shown the ability to project his image, as well as the other akatsuki members images across great distance, as shown when akatsuki meets. Now, if some one can create a jutsu that teleports themselves great distance, why would they not be able to create a jutsu the projects their image, as well as others, a great distance also? This can be debated, but, I feel that it would be possible.


    4. Now, one question you may ask is " Why would the 4th hokage take orders from Madara uchiha, or anyone else for that matter?" Well, first of all, shinobi respect power and ability. If Tobi's ability does in fact prove to be great, then it is easy to understand why a 'dark kyuubi 4th hokage' would follow someone. Uchiha Madara would be the only type of badass that someone like Pein could respect, and follow.

    Please feel free to discuss this issue with me. I will think about this matter more, and post my theories here, as well as read others.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    1.) The 4th hokage is dead due to the effects of the sealing jutsu. Once he seals something with the shiki fujin, the user loses his life automatically.

    2.) Naruto's initial appearance was that of the 4th. Only until recently was it revealed that he was the 4th's son. So anytime before that, anyone could have thought that Naruto was the 4th as a kid according to your point.

    3.) I guess it could be possible for Pein to know a move similar to the 4th's Hiraishin technique but in order for him to use it, he needed to have special talismans placed in order to get from point A to point B. But as far as shown in the manga, Pein has never appeared in front of someone as a projection outside of the hideout where the sealing of the bijuu take place.

    4.) 4th is dead.

  3. #3
    FoxHound CrimsonFox's Avatar
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    Ok, how about this. when sasori's grand mother used the jutsu to heal sakura, her life was supposed to end with the use of that jutsu. Transfer one life to another. That if proof that it is possible to use a life threatening jutsu and still live. Also, the kyuubi has been shown to regenerate damaged tissue as shown with Naruto. If my theory is correct, and the 4th did indeed seal the dark half of the kyuubi within himself, it is very well possible the 4th could have survived. With the accelerated healing of the kyuubi, as well as a strong desire to live, the 4th could have survived a supposedly ' fatal jutsu'.
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    The 4th could not have lost his life automatically. If this is so, how was it that the 4th was able to put the combination for the kyuubi seal in a scroll? How was the 4th able to relay his wishes to the villagers of konoha, in that he did not wish for Naruto to be viewed as monster, but as a hero? No, the 4th did not die automatically after using the jutsu. The effects were gradual, and I feel that the dark half of the kyuubi slowed the process down further. If he did in fact die, then it is possible that the dark half of the kyuubi resurrected him, and transformed him.
    Last edited by CrimsonFox; 09-22-2007 at 03:17 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  4. #4
    GAI SENSEI 4 HOKAGE bankai's Avatar
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    1. the 4th died with the bad chakra
    2. it cant be Deidra's actual body cause it blew up into a million pieces
    ------------------------------------------
    Quote Originally Posted by CrimsonFox View Post
    The 4th could not have lost his life automatically. If this is so, how was it that the 4th was able to put the combination for the kyuubi seal in a scroll? How was the 4th able to relay his wishes to the villagers of konoha, in that he did not wish for Naruto to be viewed as monster, but as a hero? No, the 4th did not die automatically after using the jutsu. The effects were gradual, and I feel that the dark half of the kyuubi slowed the process down further. If he did in fact die, then it is possible that the dark half of the kyuubi resurrected him, and transformed him.
    he did all of that before he fought the nine tails
    Last edited by bankai; 09-22-2007 at 03:21 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost
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  5. #5
    hmm pretty cool theory, its a possibility, and makes sense. But the thing i don't get is does he still remember naruto as his son? even if ur uper evil, The father always tries to take his son under his wing





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    Regular Member Wolfs_Run's Avatar
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    hes probably a trainee of jiriya or sumthing and has a grudge

  7. #7
    FoxHound CrimsonFox's Avatar
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    it does not appear to be a grudge that Pein has with the old sannin. He only states that he has no more love for him. He was going to kill him anyway, no matter whether it was his old teacher, or anyone else. It was still an intruder. to him, an intruder is an intruder. All is fair in love and war, and this is indeed a war.
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    Also, if the 4th died with the 'dark kyuubi chakra', then where is that chakra now? Why is it not out destroying everything? The dark half is still being controlled by a very powerful shinobi. It has to be kept under contro. think about this. When Sasuke meets Naruto for the first time after the skip, he uses the sharingan to enter Naruto's conscious. After a few words, the kyuubi tells Sasuke, ' Don't kill Naruto. You would regret it.' If the vessel of the kyuubi is destroyed, then the kyuubi would be let loose once again.
    Last edited by CrimsonFox; 09-22-2007 at 03:35 AM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

  8. #8
    Out his mind pranabowjake's Avatar
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    maybe it's just the 4th's consciousness. since he seems to move around different bodies. and that may be something that zetsu's jitsu/eating people thing does. like if zetsu eats a ninja he devours their soul and puts their soulless bodies, like a puzzle, together with other soulless bodies and makes "dolls" per say for pein to use. one of his bodies could be the soulless body of the 4th. and pein himself could be the 4th's conscious mixed with some of the conscious of the evil kyubi. which is why he body jumps because he no longer has a soul and his conscious is able to jump through soulless bodies.

  9. #9
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CrimsonFox View Post
    Ok, how about this. when sasori's grand mother used the jutsu to heal sakura, her life was supposed to end with the use of that jutsu. Transfer one life to another. That if proof that it is possible to use a life threatening jutsu and still live. Also, the kyuubi has been shown to regenerate damaged tissue as shown with Naruto. If my theory is correct, and the 4th did indeed seal the dark half of the kyuubi within himself, it is very well possible the 4th could have survived. With the accelerated healing of the kyuubi, as well as a strong desire to live, the 4th could have survived a supposedly ' fatal jutsu'.
    The jutsu heals by transferring Chiyo's life force into the target. The only reason why Chiyo survived the use of that jutsu was because Sakura was still alive. When she used the same jutsu on a dead Gaara, the jutsu took her life and resurrected Gaara. If you use all your life force, you die...And if you don't use it all, you don't die. The Shiki Fujin technique requires that you use your soul as an offering, effectively making it a self-sacrificing jutsu. The summoned Shinigami consumes your soul and the object you seal.

    And the dark kyuubi chakra was consumed by the Shinigami along with the 4th's soul.
    Last edited by Afro Thunda; 09-22-2007 at 03:57 AM.

  10. #10
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    Umm, the other half of the kyuubi chakra is in or connected to the scroll in chapter 370. It's release is under the control of whoever has the scroll. It was when they gave Naruto a minuscule taste of the said chakra that he went out of control and injured Jiraya.

    I think that the "dark" chakra is within Naruto as well, however it is completely sealed off, while the other half can be drawn from.

    The 4th lived for the Leaf Village and died defending it. That was how he was. If he lived he would've continued being the 4th and the 3rd would've been able to properly retire.
    Last edited by KingSoze; 09-22-2007 at 04:56 AM.

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