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  1. #41
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pure Logic View Post
    I don't know I kinda feel, that Obito is somewhat defeated, I think being cut in half signifies him loosing his willpower, he's become to realize some things, and Willpower was most likely the Sage's greatest feature... to defeat the Juubi "Using Naruto as an example". I think Naruto's Willpower to... never give up, is why the tailed beast think he is the one who the Sage is talking about. The DNA might be a cool design, or might be very important to the story, and the predictions we have might be TOTALLY different this Kishi's plan. The sword might do something totally different, instead of alter dna, or "Inject DNA of the Juubi" If you think about it, HOW did Obito get his hands on it, it must of came from the Juubi.
    YES, Obito is fully defeated, physically and psychologically, but his death is almost certainly not immediate. In shonen Manga, such vilains seldom die instantly, Obito probably has a few words to say to Minato and or Naruto, or them to him.

    YES, the sword may just have a cool design, I think I said that too. Nobody knows Kishi's plan, all we can do is make intuitive guesses. However, Kishi is a smart man, and uysing a double helix design for design alone amounts to cruelly trolling the fans, do you agree?

    Yes, the will to never give up is important, but what really made the Bijuus believe in Naruto is the way he was the first human to Care about them, and not bear ill will toward them, To not resent being made a Jinchuuriki, to accept them as living beings and even appologizing to them.

    Just to be clear and certain, Naruto has not defeated the Juubi, Both He and Sasuke together, defeated Obito.

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  2. #42
    The one and only Pure Logic's Avatar
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    I agree, it would be a massive troll if the sword, didn't do anything. That's why I feel it wasn't the Sage's Sword to begin with, It's apart of the Juubi. the Sage look actually comes from the Juubi, and with it weapons and other stuff. How did Obito get the sword... it must of been a strand of the Juubi's DNA maybe? I can't wait for it to be explained, but I do feel like Madara is going to come in and get the Juubi or take over Obito. Sasuke and Naruto together defeat Obito... but I think Naruto's words and will had a major effect on him. Lets be serious Obito could of had killed them with ease. I also wonder about the fruit that spouts each Millennium.

  3. #43
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Something that's been bothering me (a little) about the Konoha Nine sharing a Rasengan each (given them by Naruto), is this, What is the Point/Need?

    Naruto Created the 9 Rassengans, then In order to share them out, he had to extend a Rikudo style cloak over his friends, then Naurto's friends pushed those rassengans at Obito's shield.

    My question is, isn't this a pointless waste of chakra? Why didn't Naruto use all that chakra to form a nice juicy concentrated Sejutsu Bijuu Darma, and blast the shield himself, followed by the combined Sasuke/Naruto Susanoo Sword?

    What advantage was gained by Sharing Chakra to the Nine? Kishi risks losing meaningful or believable action, by overdoing the symbolism.

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  4. #44
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    ^ Well, even a few perhaps.

    First of, by giving out those Rasengans before clashing with Obito, a considerable amount of burden on his mind and concentration was lifted, which allowed Naruto to fully concentrate on slashing Obito, who already showcased to have inhuman amounts of will power and power, thus it certainly was useful.

    Second, technically speaking Naruto could create a similar effect by creating clones, unfortunately, it's quite likely that the clones itself wouldn't be able to withstand the strain that the clash between the Black Shield and Rasengans would give (they had to break through it). Another advantage is that Naruto can control the distribution of the Naru-Kurama Chakra to other people, while he can't control the amounts of chakra that are split between the KBs (it's always by an equal amount), thus, chakra-wise, empowering other people and giving them Rasengans was more advantageous, since Naruto had to preserve as much of his chakra as possible for a definitive hit. It's also worth mentioning that the amounts of clones that Naruto can make in Sage Mode, might still be limited to only a few.

    Third, it also proved as a mind attack against Obito, which quite largely reduced his concentration and will power by invoking, sort of, delusion of feasible alternative reality, right before the clash, which in the end proved to be fatal. The weakening of his will might also result in Madara or Jyuubi taking over him (since his will was the only thing that protected him from both of their mind-body-control attacks).

    Fourth, it had a symbolical meaning.

    Fifth, it was awesome.

    Sixth, it showcased the difference between Naruto and Obito.

    Seventh, it showcased the difference between Naruto and Sasuke.

    Eight, it gave meaning and purpose to the bystanders.

    Ninth, it was a resume and culmination of Naruto's achievements in social activities.



  5. #45
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    ^ Well, even a few perhaps.

    First of, by giving out those Rasengans before clashing with Obito, a considerable amount of burden on his mind and concentration was lifted, which allowed Naruto to fully concentrate on slashing Obito, who already showcased to have inhuman amounts of will power and power, thus it certainly was useful.

    Second, technically speaking Naruto could create a similar effect by creating clones, unfortunately, it's quite likely that the clones itself wouldn't be able to withstand the strain that the clash between the Black Shield and Rasengans would give (they had to break through it). Another advantage is that Naruto can control the distribution of the Naru-Kurama Chakra to other people, while he can't control the amounts of chakra that are split between the KBs (it's always by an equal amount), thus, chakra-wise, empowering other people and giving them Rasengans was more advantageous, since Naruto had to preserve as much of his chakra as possible for a definitive hit. It's also worth mentioning that the amounts of clones that Naruto can make in Sage Mode, might still be limited to only a few.

    Third, it also proved as a mind attack against Obito, which quite largely reduced his concentration and will power by invoking, sort of, delusion of feasible alternative reality, right before the clash, which in the end proved to be fatal. The weakening of his will might also result in Madara or Jyuubi taking over him (since his will was the only thing that protected him from both of their mind-body-control attacks).

    Fourth, it had a symbolical meaning.

    Fifth, it was awesome.

    Sixth, it showcased the difference between Naruto and Obito.

    Seventh, it showcased the difference between Naruto and Sasuke.

    Eight, it gave meaning and purpose to the bystanders.

    Ninth, it was a resume and culmination of Naruto's achievements in social activities.
    I like Number 9 the best. Now if he could only find a way to graduate from Genin to Chounin.........

    I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
    Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !

  6. #46
    Senior Member knife eater's Avatar
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    It was a masterful demonstration by Naruto, for Obito's sake, what it is like to have friends to follow you into a peril because of what you command in and of their hearts along with their desire to believe in you and share any burden. That is what I feel was the exact point and that demonstration was the primary contributing factor to Obito's vision of the other reality had he chosen to rely on and treat his friends in the way Naruto had done to earn their willingness for "9 buddies rasengan!"

    It was very much illustrating "friend factor" in the best possible way given the scope of the battle situation and what Naruto needed to teach Obito.

    That was the point, as for the actual NEED.. I would guess it is because clones would, at that point, begin to diminish the potency of reach rasengan and that susanoo's armor was covering everything else except for the tail-ends? It seemed like a humorous logistical necessity.
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  7. #47
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by knife eater View Post
    It was a masterful demonstration by Naruto, for Obito's sake, what it is like to have friends to follow you into a peril because of what you command in and of their hearts along with their desire to believe in you and share any burden. That is what I feel was the exact point and that demonstration was the primary contributing factor to Obito's vision of the other reality had he chosen to rely on and treat his friends in the way Naruto had done to earn their willingness for "9 buddies rasengan!"

    It was very much illustrating "friend factor" in the best possible way given the scope of the battle situation and what Naruto needed to teach Obito.

    That was the point, as for the actual NEED.. I would guess it is because clones would, at that point, begin to diminish the potency of reach rasengan and that susanoo's armor was covering everything else except for the tail-ends? It seemed like a humorous logistical necessity.

    Okay, I sorta get it, because it does demonstrate what friends could do, However, Let's face it. Naruto was the one who needed to get his friends into this not as a power-up, but for his own psychological comfort. I say this because he used so much chakra in transforming all 9 friends into a Rikuudou cloak, which was wasteful I think, on top of also forming Odama Rassengans.

    Naruto may have been better off creating One single Senjutsu Bijuu Darma (Beast Bomb), there would have been more power, and less chakra wasted.

    The only advantage I can see is that Summoning his friends could have Psychologically weakened Obito's Resolve to where he didn't make his sheild as strong as it could have been. Frankly the Beast Bomb Naruto and Kurama used against the Other Bijuus was a heck of a lot stronger than the 9 Rassengans he used on that black shield, ot to talk of the chakra wasted by him needing to suround his friends with the Rikuudou mode cloaks.

    Spoiler!

    Wasted Chakra

    Spoiler!

    Bijuu Darma Stronger than all 9 Rassengans


    Anyway I made my point, no need to overstate things

    I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
    Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !

  8. #48
    Senior Member knife eater's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    Okay, I sorta get it, because it does demonstrate what friends could do, However, Let's face it. Naruto was the one who needed to get his friends into this not as a power-up, but for his own psychological comfort. I say this because he used so much chakra in transforming all 9 friends into a Rikuudou cloak, which was wasteful I think, on top of also forming Odama Rassengans.

    Naruto may have been better off creating One single Senjutsu Bijuu Darma (Beast Bomb), there would have been more power, and less chakra wasted.

    The only advantage I can see is that Summoning his friends could have Psychologically weakened Obito's Resolve to where he didn't make his sheild as strong as it could have been. Frankly the Beast Bomb Naruto and Kurama used against the Other Bijuus was a heck of a lot stronger than the 9 Rassengans he used on that black shield, ot to talk of the chakra wasted by him needing to suround his friends with the Rikuudou mode cloaks.

    Spoiler!

    Wasted Chakra

    Spoiler!

    Bijuu Darma Stronger than all 9 Rassengans


    Anyway I made my point, no need to overstate things
    im going with the psychological angle for both naruto's comfort and obito's education. as far as the chakra use is concerned, it looks like kakashi is facepalming considering that he knows better than anybody the importance and strain of wise chakra management.
    _____
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  9. #49
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Perhaps the large Sage Rasengans (strengthened due to being projected by the Susano'o/Kyuubi tails and the Bijuu Cloak Rookies) provided a more pinpointed attack than a large Bijuudama would, thus allowing the Sage Susano'o sword (thrust by the Sage Kyuubi) to puncture the weakened point on the shield.

    The reason I factor in every single power-up / third party present in the attacks is to emphasize the role teamwork played in the effort in a more quantifiable way; it wasn't just a morale boost, and it WAS better than simply launching an all-out Bijuudama. Even a MiniBijuudama would not have maintained its full destructive capacity in a concentrated location, but would instead explode into a wide blast radius. Only the Rasengan could continuously hit the same relatively small point, so using that technique was wise. The only extra thing I'd live to have seen is a Chidori-enfused Susano'o blade, since it's Sasuke's signature "piercing attack," and Obito was probably using the single strongest barrier we'll ever see. It would also make the Chidori more relevant in Sasuke's current Susano'o-based arsenal if he could channel it through Susano'o.

  10. #50
    Scanlator POW's Avatar
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    Yea pretty much what Rif said above ^

    - The Bijuu bomb is large AoE attack thus it cant be used close to other people without putting them in danger. Same reason KB didn't use it in his fight with Kisame cause that other guy was near.

    - The the Kyuubu-Sage Rasengans are more accurate weapons.

    I also wanted to see Sasuke use Chidori with his Susanoo Sword & Naruto use a Bijuu bomb Rasenshuriken.


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