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  1. #41
    Senior Member drgnx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    I had hoped for OMZ to be integrated, and he was, but I am not pleased with the TWIN blade thing, what happens when he goes Banki? Will they merge?

    .
    Quote Originally Posted by kiduka View Post
    They will most likely merge in Bankai, my theory is he slots Bach into Hichigo to activate Bankai and they merge into one blade.
    I hope this Happens
    Quote Originally Posted by Uzumaki_Tim View Post
    It's also very appropriate that the Whitey blade has a 'hollow' hole in it
    Make sense!
    Spoiler!

  2. #42
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    Hmmmmmmm, so have Whitey degenerated into his old form + Fullbring separately ? Or is the Horn Mask now only a composition of his Bankai ? If that's the case, why didn't he gain it when he entered Bankai in Vizard inner training ? Or is it that when Zanpakutou evolves, it only gains powers and abilities in Bankai, but Shikai remain the same ? Seeing as he has his old clothes without Fullbring, does this mean that gains the old clothes in Bankai as well ?

    How much is OMZ fused with Ichigo's Shinigami Powers, for him to actually become a Real Zanpakutou ? Seeing as Ichigo still had Fullbring when Oetsu was reforging Whitey, it really seems that it is fused with OMZ. In that case, does this mean that a bit of Shinigami Power that is fused with Ichigo's Fullbring, is now also fused with OMZ seeing as he is the holder of the Fullbring ?

    From the looks of it and Ichigo's wording, it looks like we won't see FGT any longer (unless the world is about to end if he doesn't use it ?). After all, it works by sacrificing your own Zanpakutou and Ichigo said that he will no longer ask nor rely on it's power only, but on himself.

    Speaking about the fight with Aizen, seeing as TZ seems to be OMZ after all (at least the probabilities have turned around ), does this mean that against Aizen Ichigo was using his True Zanpakutou, true power ? Or was it still limited ? At least this explains why Ichigo could rise his power so suddenly, since the answer seems to be that he didn't rise it, he always had it and only started using it for real. This also explains why he could feel Aizen's reiatsu even before training, since he already was on that level, only not using that much power.



  3. #43
    Senior Member kiduka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    Speaking about the fight with Aizen, seeing as TZ seems to be OMZ after all (at least the probabilities have turned around ), does this mean that against Aizen Ichigo was using his True Zanpakutou, true power ? Or was it still limited ? At least this explains why Ichigo could rise his power so suddenly, since the answer seems to be that he didn't rise it, he always had it and only started using it for real. This also explains why he could feel Aizen's reiatsu even before training, since he already was on that level, only not using that much power.
    That still confuses me, and I get confused even more thinking about it.

    As I understand it Whitey is the real Zanpakutou and OMZ is the manifestation of his Quincy powers so why did OMZ change form into a younger person?

    Another thing I seem to recall is in Bankai mode Whitey still referred to himself as Zangetsu but OMZ apparantly changed and become Tensa Zangetsu when his really Juha Bach.

    Flipping heck now I'm confused again lol

  4. #44
    Senior Member Anticrobotic's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiduka View Post
    They will most likely merge in Bankai, my theory is he slots Bach into Hichigo to activate Bankai and they merge into one blade.
    On second thought...uh-oh. That's a perfect setup for a yaoi doujinshi right there for ya!

  5. #45
    Senior Member kuroihikari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kiduka View Post
    That still confuses me, and I get confused even more thinking about it.

    As I understand it Whitey is the real Zanpakutou and OMZ is the manifestation of his Quincy powers so why did OMZ change form into a younger person?

    Another thing I seem to recall is in Bankai mode Whitey still referred to himself as Zangetsu but OMZ apparantly changed and become Tensa Zangetsu when his really Juha Bach.

    Flipping heck now I'm confused again lol
    Short Answer: OMZ isn't the same Juha Bach that currently leads the Quincies.

    Long Answer: When Juha Bach founded the Quincies he put a part of him, his essence, in every Quincy. Every true-blooded Quincy has this part of Juha Bach inside themselves that becomes part of them when they're born. OMZ is that part of Juha Bach that is inside Ichigo, not the Juha Bach we know. He looks younger because he looks the age of Juha Bach way back then: The part that was transferred from Masaki's ancestors to Masaki, then to Ichigo. Tensa Zangetsu is an even younger person.

    H. Ichigo was that hollow that got transferred to Ichigo from Masaki from the infection.

    Now, we know that:
    1. For Shinigami their Zanpakutou is the spirit that resides inside them.
    2. Ichigo is part Shinigami because of his father.
    3. Ichigo knows the name of the "spirit" which resides inside him: "Zangetsu".
    4. There are two spirits (that we know of) that are inside Ichigo: OMZ the Quincy essence, and Hichigo the hollow infection.

    Therefore, what Ichigo realized is that his zanpakutou are BOTH the spirits that are inside him: Hichigo and OMZ. So technically, they're both part of zangetsu, even if they're entirely different things.

  6. #46
    Senior Member kiduka's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kuroihikari View Post
    Short Answer: OMZ isn't the same Juha Bach that currently leads the Quincies.

    Long Answer: When Juha Bach founded the Quincies he put a part of him, his essence, in every Quincy. Every true-blooded Quincy has this part of Juha Bach inside themselves that becomes part of them when they're born. OMZ is that part of Juha Bach that is inside Ichigo, not the Juha Bach we know. He looks younger because he looks the age of Juha Bach way back then: The part that was transferred from Masaki's ancestors to Masaki, then to Ichigo. Tensa Zangetsu is an even younger person.

    H. Ichigo was that hollow that got transferred to Ichigo from Masaki from the infection.

    Now, we know that:
    1. For Shinigami their Zanpakutou is the spirit that resides inside them.
    2. Ichigo is part Shinigami because of his father.
    3. Ichigo knows the name of the "spirit" which resides inside him: "Zangetsu".
    4. There are two spirits (that we know of) that are inside Ichigo: OMZ the Quincy essence, and Hichigo the hollow infection.

    Therefore, what Ichigo realized is that his zanpakutou are BOTH the spirits that are inside him: Hichigo and OMZ. So technically, they're both part of zangetsu, even if they're entirely different things.
    Thanks for the explanation but I know all that, my post was referring to Zero's comment about "Tensa Zangetsu" since his the one who confuses me.

  7. #47
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Anticrobotic View Post
    On second thought...uh-oh. That's a perfect setup for a yaoi doujinshi right there for ya!
    Ichigo's Inner World is probably the biggest source of fantasies for Yaoi fans (the seconds biggest one is probably the interactions between Azien and Ichigo ):
    Spoiler!


    No matter how much they dream, we all know that this is what's really going on :
    Spoiler!


    Well technically this also is possible:
    Spoiler!

    after all, Shinigami CAN manifest their inner zan spirits .


    Well, anyway, if someone was wondering how Ichigo would look with an asauchi :
    Spoiler!



  8. #48
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    I'll say this..Just a thought.

    Hichigo is almost as much an impostor as OMZ. The only difference is that Whitey was designed to fuse with the Host Shinigami, and baby Ichigo never had a chance.

    Calling Hichigo "Zangetsu" without an asteriskis not entirely precise. Hichigo is Ichigo's true Zanpakuto corrupted and defieled by a vile Hollow (originally). Ichigo's greatest asset is to never cry over spilt milk, but to move ahead.

    So, IF Hichigo can be accepted, then why not OMZ too?

    There is one sense that OMZ is even better than Hichigo. If you see both Whitey and OMZ as intruders or viruses, One of them at least..(OMZ) gave Ichigo the opportunity to accept or decline his presence, plus OMZ has always ever only tried to keep Ichigo safe. Whitey through Hichigo would have killed him if it had the chance.

    Hichigo was honest, as an honest bully. OMZ was honest as an intruder who wished his host no harm, and even became fond of him.

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  9. #49
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    I'll say this..Just a thought.

    Hichigo is almost as much an impostor as OMZ. The only difference is that Whitey was designed to fuse with the Host Shinigami, and baby Ichigo never had a chance.

    Calling Hichigo "Zangetsu" without an asteriskis not entirely precise. Hichigo is Ichigo's true Zanpakuto corrupted and defieled by a vile Hollow (originally). Ichigo's greatest asset is to never cry over spilt milk, but to move ahead.

    So, IF Hichigo can be accepted, then why not OMZ too?

    There is one sense that OMZ is even better than Hichigo. If you see both Whitey and OMZ as intruders or viruses, One of them at least..(OMZ) gave Ichigo the opportunity to accept or decline his presence, plus OMZ has always ever only tried to keep Ichigo safe. Whitey through Hichigo would have killed him if it had the chance.

    Hichigo was honest, as an honest bully. OMZ was honest as an intruder who wished his host no harm, and even became fond of him.
    Nope, at least it doesn't look like that to me.

    Sure, I guess both of them can be viewed as inherited intruders, but then, isn't his Shinigami Power the same ? From the looks of it, almost all powers, beside the true origin, are infections of some sort in that context (well maybe not for pure hollows ). A person is filled with a power by a third party and that power simply grows and evolves from that, rather than being truly born form within without any input from the outside.

    If Whitey could fuse with Ichigo's Shinigami Power, then it's rational that he would become a Zanpakutou, but then the same would need to be applied to OMZ for him to also become a Zanpakutou and this is seemingly done in this chapter, thus OMZ also gaining some Shinigami Power into his own mix, assuming that he wasn't like that from the beginning. Yeah, OMZ having a part of the Shinigami Fused into him from the start, or because of the years of suppressing that power (some flown to him ?), would at least explain some things, it would actually explain why he could become Tensa Zangetsu at one point (since it would mean that the part of the Shinigami power in OMZ would have invoked that change).

    The thing is that OMZ was always accepted, while Whitey was never. Ichigo can finally truly accept his power, truly accept himself, even more than what he accepted at the end of the Dangai training.

    Both of them had one common goal, to protect Ichigo, you could even say that after they fused, that was the link that truly bonded them together. The only difference was that Whitey was ready to annihilate everything around, to eliminate even the slightest possibility of Ichigo getting hurt (pretty extreme if I have to say so myself ), regardless of Ichigo's own will (Ichigo's and his inner spirits goals were always different anyway), well almost everything, since he didn't touch Orihime after all :p. While OMZ had other goals than only protecting Ichigo, though at some point, his other goals were linked to that one of protecting him, though it could also be said that the goal of protecting Ichigo was used as an excuse to continue hindering him and his progress. Both of them almost never lied, at least in their actions.



  10. #50
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Zero, If Hichigo had taken over, Ichigo would have turned into a hollow Flat Out, and this had happened to other Shinigami who didn't benefit from Urahara's treatment, we also saw/heard the same from the Vizards.

    What i am saying is that Hichigo did not consider Ichigo himself and only wanted to control it's own fate even if it meant that Ichigo became a Hollow and essentially "die" or be put to death. I am not even sure that Hichigo has really accepted ichigo, it Has accepted that Ichigo is the Boss, but that is not the same as accepting him as a person. At the same time, it's fair to say that OMZ came to accept Ichigo as a person, and stopped trying to treat/use him as a tool all by himself.

    I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
    Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !

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