View Poll Results: Rate the Chapter!

Voters
11. You may not vote on this poll
  • 5 -- Excellent

    9 81.82%
  • 4 -- Good

    2 18.18%
  • 3 -- Average

    0 0%
  • 2 -- Meh

    0 0%
  • 1 -- Sucked balls

    0 0%
Page 4 of 7 FirstFirst ... 2 3 4 5 6 ... LastLast
Results 31 to 40 of 64
  1. #31
    Senior Member Shock's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Honolulu, HI
    Posts
    3,995
    Lol of course Ichigos sword will be a fire Zan. Zanpakutos are made of Shinigami Souls, and guess who juuuuussssst diiiiiiieedddd lol

    CC is back! In the form of a talking sword in the hands of an emotionally unstable teenager!!! Hilarious new manga, coming this fall.
    A pie in the sky?

  2. #32
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    3,778
    Quote Originally Posted by Anticrobotic View Post
    The thing is, we never actually saw the moment when he acheived bankai. There might be a reason for that.
    Well technically, the condition to achieve his Bankai was to find out which sword is the real one, OMZ was only there to speed the process, he didn't teach him anything (beside better tactics and swordsmanship >>> continuing lesson where Urahara stopped), he only put pressure to do what he should do. Basically, you could say that OMZ was yelling to his ears when Ichigo was doing push ups, nothing more. The whole point was that each of those swords were real, a part of his True Zanpakutou, all Ichigo had to do is draw out his True Zanpakutou's Power (Whitey) and force out it's specialized technique that gets a boost in Bankai. The moment Ichigo gained it, automatically OMZ also achieved that knowledge, though the only one to enter Bankai was Hichigo, OMZ is never shown to enter or even be able to use Bankai.

    Funny enough, at that point it was already possible to deduce that the current sword (at that time) also can be nothing more than part of the oryginal blade, seeing as all those parts had different shapes.

    It's still wasn't reveled what exactly is Tensa Zangetsu, but seeing as he is younger, has blue eyes and is much shorter, has black hair, it's doubtful that OMZ and TS are the same, especially seeing as they have everything different about them (clothes are similar but not that much when remove the overcoat), even personalities.

    From what I can tell, basing on Renji's and Ichigo's case, one of the main/final requirements, or perhaps simply bonuses, is that the user needs to master a technique that gains an upgrade in Bankai mode. In Ichigo's case it was GT >>> Kuro Getsuga (though Ichigo technically hasn't obtained yet the true name and thus power of his Bankai technique), while for Renji it was that Sword-Split-Then-Rain-down move. It's quite likely that for Hitsugaya it was that Ice Petal Rain, since he admits that he can use it in Shikai, while it's too powerful in Bankai to use freely. Basically, a technique that bases on the core power of one's Zanpakutou (in Hitsugaya's case, it was control of the weather in accordance to water and ice).


    The members of the Shiba clan seem to posses elemental powers, but they all might have a different one. Let's take a closer look how it looks or for now seems:
    - Kaien - Water,
    - Ishin - Fire,
    - Ganju - Sand/Earth - well he does mainly use those techniques, which they don't teach in the Shinigami School, so perhaps this is his element, or just one of the many specialized spells of the Shiba Clan,
    - Kukaku - Lightning/Multi - well she was shown doing lightning spells, so she might have an affinity towards it, though her red clothes might suggest Fire, or really multi since she seems able to use many elements.

    When one has an element, their spells tend to be based on that element (since they have the greatest affinity) or they are even limited to them, of course plus non-elemental ones. You can notice that by looking at Yamamaoto for example, or at Renji for which all spells gain an "Explosive" character regardless what spell he uses and really can only use blasts spells. His Bankai even posses an energy explosive beam attack, so there might something in there , or he simply sucks at demon arts :p.
    Last edited by Zero; 06-12-2013 at 07:48 PM.


  3. #33
    Prick List: Gaara, Bee Genesis 1.0's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Location
    Baltimore, MD
    Posts
    829
    This chapter was beautiful and the emotion flowed instead of being forced. It was legitimately and literally a passing of the torch moment when someone actually recognizes Ichigo's progress as a character, into a man. Even when he doesn't believe in himself, Innner Juha does simply by watching him grow. Excellent.

    "For I being a poor man, have only my dreams & I have spread them beneath your feet. Tread carefully, for you tread upon my dreams."

  4. #34
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Fargo, North Dakota USA
    Posts
    6,854
    @Zero,

    You keep saying that Tensa Zangetsu and OMZ were not the same, but they have to be.

    Ichigo showed his Bankai as far back as when he fought Byakuya in the Save Rukia arc. and Ichigo was in Bankai when Hichigo LEVELOO 4 came out and annihilated Ulquiorra, Recall that OMZ revealed that whenever Ichigo's life was in danger he (OMZ) sent out The Hollow to save Ichigo .

    IN OTHER WORDS, OMZ was in charge, deciding who to send to save Ichigo, during Bankai. If tensa Zangetsu is not equal to OMZ, then OMZ should not have been able to decide what happened at a time when Ichigo was in Bankai.

    OMZ == Tensa Zangetsu.


    Quote Originally Posted by Genesis 1.0 View Post
    This chapter was beautiful and the emotion flowed instead of being forced. It was legitimately and literally a passing of the torch moment when someone actually recognizes Ichigo's progress as a character, into a man. Even when he doesn't believe in himself, Innner Juha does simply by watching him grow. Excellent.
    Totally agreed.

    I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
    Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !

  5. #35
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    3,778
    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    @Zero,

    You keep saying that Tensa Zangetsu and OMZ were not the same, but they have to be.

    Ichigo showed his Bankai as far back as when he fought Byakuya in the Save Rukia arc. and Ichigo was in Bankai when Hichigo LEVELOO 4 came out and annihilated Ulquiorra, Recall that OMZ revealed that whenever Ichigo's life was in danger he (OMZ) sent out The Hollow to save Ichigo .

    IN OTHER WORDS, OMZ was in charge, deciding who to send to save Ichigo, during Bankai. If tensa Zangetsu is not equal to OMZ, then OMZ should not have been able to decide what happened at a time when Ichigo was in Bankai.

    OMZ == Tensa Zangetsu.
    Hm ? You are saying as if Zangetsu were the same as OMZ and thus Tensa Zangetsu should be the same, but it's not like that. OMZ is not a Zanpakutou (from what we know), he simply took over the Zanpakutou and it's parts and was inhibiting and channeling it's power through himself, but he himself was never the Zanpakutou (well maybe now he will be, who knows ). The Hollow Part was the one that went beyond his control, but most of the shinigami part was under his control.

    To simply put, it dependent on OMZ how much of the actual power of the True Zangetsu was channeled to Ichigo through himself, not counting the Hollow that went out of control. From what I understood, he allowed a portion of the Shinigami part Bankai out, so that Ichigo would at least have enough power to defend himself, but when Ichigo was in trouble, Whitey Z, was the one that forced his way out to help Ichigo and he did it multiple times (seemingly most of the time Whitey was out of OMZ's control).

    Beside, the most important clue about TZ and OMZ being different (beside obvious difference in personality and appearance) is how important the name is to each one of them. "Zangetsu" is not OMZ's real name, he even was OK when he was called Old Man, it didn't matter because it was never his real name anyway. On the other hand, Tensa Zangetsu is different, he didn't want to accept Ichigo calling him just "Zangetsu", when he actually is "Tensa Zangetsu". He had to reprimand him about that, so that Ichigo would realize that he is different from the Hollow Zangetsu and the Fake Zangetsu.


  6. #36
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    Posts
    136
    Nope OMZ and Tensa Zangetsu are for sure the same person, just like he lied about his name being Zangetsu, he later lied about his name being tensa zangetsu.

    There are several reasons. The first and most important one is that Tensa Zangetsu claims to be the same person and giving an explanation about the different appearance.

    The second one is that during their fight, Tensa Zangetsu references a previous discussion he, as OMZ, had with Ichigo about the rain in Ichigo's inner world and how the situation has now become a lot worse even though the rain has stopped.

    Third, if they were not the same person, it would have been the first meeting between those two and Tensa Zangetsu would have told Ichigo about the "Zangetsu" imposter.

    Fourth, Tensa Zangetsu looks exactly like the younger version of OMZ

    There is no doubt that OMZ == Tensa Zangetsu


    Edit: About the Bankai training.
    The main goal was to beat your Zanpakuto in Submission, it was just that OMZ chose this battle with the many swords. Renji's battle was comletely different. So if the main goal is to beat your Zanpakuto into submission, where was Hollow Ichigo? And even if we didn't see the actual moment, Yuroichi did and never once was it mentioned that Hollow Ichigo made an appearance, no later Ichigo even referred to OMZ teaching him the name of Getsuga Tenshou and thus increasing it's power and again there was no hollow.

    Like I said, it's quite the sloppy retcon, I doubt we will ever get proper explanations.

  7. #37
    The French Tickler pratesh's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Earth
    Posts
    380
    Did OMZ kill himself and remove his Quincy powers or was that part absorbed by his Shinigami/Hollow part? If its the former, then Ichigo will no longer have blut or any of those qunicy powers and that barrier that he was caught in the last time will be to much for him this time around. If its the latter, then does that mean that in his Shinigami form, he will be able to execute Qunicy moves?

  8. #38
    Global Moderator Jaiden's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Florida
    Posts
    4,836
    Quote Originally Posted by Zero View Post
    Really ? I did notice, at first I wanted to write that there were manly tears flowing, like a parent seeing his child being able to stand on his own and letting him go onward... but I though that everyone did notice that in the other version . Don't tell me that you also hadn't notice how Ichigo falls into doubt, right after the start (the rain starts to fall), then into despair when he learns that his name isn't Zangetsu (the world falls into endless water body) and at the end the shining light of hope and truth encompasses all (expect that his skyscrapers might above clouds next time ).
    I noticed all that other stuff, it's the tears I didn't notice before.

    Quote Originally Posted by Shock View Post
    Lol of course Ichigos sword will be a fire Zan. Zanpakutos are made of Shinigami Souls, and guess who juuuuussssst diiiiiiieedddd lol

    CC is back! In the form of a talking sword in the hands of an emotionally unstable teenager!!! Hilarious new manga, coming this fall.
    LOL! I laugh but I would really like to see that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Genesis 1.0 View Post
    This chapter was beautiful and the emotion flowed instead of being forced. It was legitimately and literally a passing of the torch moment when someone actually recognizes Ichigo's progress as a character, into a man. Even when he doesn't believe in himself, Innner Juha does simply by watching him grow. Excellent.
    +1

    Manga reading list: Bleach, Naruto, Katekyo Hitman Reborn, One Piece, Code Breaker, Gamaran, Kuroko No Basket, Fairy Tail, The World God Only Knows, Kimi No Iru Machi, Good Ending, Medaka Box, Nisekoi, D.Gray-Man, Ao No Exorcist, Freezing, Magi - Labyrinth of Magic, Soul Eater, Rosario Vampire Season II, Iris Zero, Ubell Blatt, Bloody Cross, Sun-Ken Rock, and Infinite Stratos,

  9. #39
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Posts
    3,778
    Quote Originally Posted by Argonar View Post
    Nope OMZ and Tensa Zangetsu are for sure the same person, just like he lied about his name being Zangetsu, he later lied about his name being tensa zangetsu.

    There are several reasons. The first and most important one is that Tensa Zangetsu claims to be the same person and giving an explanation about the different appearance.

    The second one is that during their fight, Tensa Zangetsu references a previous discussion he, as OMZ, had with Ichigo about the rain in Ichigo's inner world and how the situation has now become a lot worse even though the rain has stopped.

    Third, if they were not the same person, it would have been the first meeting between those two and Tensa Zangetsu would have told Ichigo about the "Zangetsu" imposter.

    Fourth, Tensa Zangetsu looks exactly like the younger version of OMZ

    There is no doubt that OMZ == Tensa Zangetsu


    Edit: About the Bankai training.
    The main goal was to beat your Zanpakuto in Submission, it was just that OMZ chose this battle with the many swords. Renji's battle was comletely different. So if the main goal is to beat your Zanpakuto into submission, where was Hollow Ichigo? And even if we didn't see the actual moment, Yuroichi did and never once was it mentioned that Hollow Ichigo made an appearance, no later Ichigo even referred to OMZ teaching him the name of Getsuga Tenshou and thus increasing it's power and again there was no hollow.

    Like I said, it's quite the sloppy retcon, I doubt we will ever get proper explanations.
    It doesn't make much sense for them to be the same.

    First of, TZ is silent when Ichigo remarks that only Old Man Z should be here (at this point proving that he himself is not him) two pages:
    Spoiler!


    After that he says that "...it's no surprise that you don't recognize this form":
    Spoiler!

    He might have meant the real Zangetsu, or at least part of Shinigami Zangetsu, who is mostly suppressed in Shikai by OMZ. The reason a part of him is released in Bankai, is because he is likely needed for Bankai. It's a full release, thus to use it, Ichigo needs to have access at least to portions of what his Zan is made (it is made from both, Hollow and Shinigami powers).

    "Are you Zangetsu":
    Spoiler!

    The answer is "no", he is "Tensa Zangetsu", thus neither OMZ or Whitey (he mentions that he is not the Zangetsu/s that Ichigo knows but a different one). The way ha answer it is also important (the clouds are outlined and in bold, suggesting an intimidating serious tone and that face):
    Spoiler!


    He says that the reason their inner world is this way, because Ichigo despaired and cased to walk forward (they all see and experience the same things, so it's no surprise that they are affected by the same thing):
    Spoiler!

    OMZ wouldn't say this line, because OMZ himself inhibits Ichigo's growth as he mentioned in current chapter. Why would he be angry at Ichigo, if it was his own fault ? Thus he cannot be OMZ. He literally forces him to move forward:
    Spoiler!

    while OMZ constantly inhibits him. If OMZ was able to inhibit him further at that point, Ichigo would not went out to fight Aizen, as he was previously ready to give up. Why would OMZ want to pull out the Hollow Part that he himself no longer can control ?

    Here, TZ and Whitey admit to be parts of the same being, which is Ichigo's Zanpakutou, as mentioned by Oetsu:
    Spoiler!


    If that was OMZ, then the Fusion Zangetsu wouldn't say "two parts" but "three". Thus again, TZ and OMZ are not the same.

    In the current chapter, OMZ mentions that what Ichigo wielded, is only/mainly the power that he couldn't suppress and that is White Zangetsu/Whitey:
    Spoiler!

    While the Black Zangetsu/TZ is the power that he released so that Ichigo could achieve Bankai. He also means that this is his True Own Power and not when OMZ was his main power core.

    Also, after looking closer, OMZ is standing on the sword, but he might not necessarily be it's part after all. Perhaps that after giving back True Zangetsu's power, he himself shrunk to his oryginal size/power and now that the True Zangetsu is released, compared to it's power, his own Quincy Power is small. This could also mean that he was himself fueling with it, perhaps in similar fashion that Opie did with that Hollow ?

    Of course let's not forget about different personalities and looks. Your eye color doesn't change with age anyway.

    He said to beat "him" into Submissions and he did, he forced out of Whitey his power and technique (as semi-mentioned by Ishin that all his techniques are drawn by force), the GT, but Ichigo himself never bested OMZ in battle and yet again this was another hint that OMZ was not Zangetsu, since the one beaten into submission was not OMZ, yet Bankai was still obtained.


  10. #40
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2007
    Location
    Fargo, North Dakota USA
    Posts
    6,854
    @zero,

    No, I'm saying that OMZ controlled the Bankai state, therefore If OMZ did not relinquish that control over Ichigo's Bankai then the Tensa Zangetsu found in the Bankai state must be OMZ in a younger appearance.

    I am not perfect and I defy you to prove otherwise
    Growing Old Gracefully is an Oxymoron ... Mostly Moron !

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •