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  1. #11
    can anyone draw what will be the end product of smoker's face? the injury seems deep.plus the previous scar.

  2. #12
    Senior Member Temperjoke's Avatar
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    Right now I don't think we can accurately estimate Luffy's strength to rank him in comparison to the other big league players. We simply haven't seen him go all out yet since the time skip. Luffy had always had difficulty fighting Logia users in the past, but we've seen that he's taken care of that issue now.

    I'm hoping that we'll get to see Zoro and Kin'emon spar together a bit, I'd like to see more about Kin'emon ability to cut flames.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Blackriot69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sirxxx View Post
    EDIT: Mangastream--http://mangastream.com/read/one_piece/72194515/1

    And after reading the "The Strawhats are lightweights" comment, DD is all but setting himself up for an epic ass-whooping.



    Yep! I absolutely do!

    To compare, pretend that we are way back in the day for a moment. Now imagine someone asks you "You can't seriously think Luffy could solo Crocodile right now..." Rookie vs. Logia?! Absolutely not!

    Yet, that's exactly what he did (well, eventually, anyway. And with Robin providing the assist so that he would survive the battle afterwards and all, but still).

    Luffy is gonna be PK--he's gonna have to start showing some strength to keep backing up that reputation he's built. Hody Jones? Caesar Clown? He can't have bullshit opponents forever.

    Besides, even if he was to survive someone like Doflamingo, there's all manner of Yonkou and Underground Broker people and Admirals and Fleet Admiral and probably Vice-Admirals ready to beat on him! So he would still have a long way yet to go.
    For two weeks now your arguments have been faceslap material. You CANNOT have a manga whose premise exists in a group of protagonists overcoming unimaginable odds to ultimately reach an unthinkable treasure at the end immediately switch to being a one shot blow out of power each and every arc, where the villain obtains little evidence of their own power, the hero(s) wields unfathamable power to defeat them, and no story exists as to why the two face off in the first place. IF that were the case, manga, especially a long running series, would be nothing more than a swift, generally repetitious/uninteresting sequence of dull/unrealistically empowered (usually get massive power boosts out of no where) characters and shallow triumphs (which is one of my biggest problems with the Fairy Tail manga).

    Such is the One Piece manga.

    What is purpose of Luffy becoming PK and the crew obtaining their goals if it happens too fast? Again, this is a problem I find in the Bleach manga, where Ichigo continually faces the same sort of villains who wish to destroy him, his family and friends, SS etc, until he is enlightened to this initially freakishly surprising power NO ONE knew he had ( I swear the number of over the shoulder head turns with frightened eyes saturate the manga and are this type of scene's curtain opening) but yet he can eventually wield to destroy them with a new bankai/whatever sword, only to shout his signature yell and stand victorious after little (or long unsatisfactory) buildup, after which he adds another similar yet "shocking" saga to his Soul Reaper, Hollow, Vizard, Fullbringer, Quincy blood line.

    However, I digress from my rant.

    My point is, One Piece is build on the premise of unpredictability (or well shrouded similarities as xiaoxiao will argue of the Grand Line and NW storylines) of each saga/arc, intricate, deep character and story developement, and overall, if not most important, smart pacing. Additionally, if your specific problem is the level at which the crew is performing, which I dare say it is and have thus otherwise, for practicality's sake, added a rather extended argument of how great manga works in my opinion, then I hope you, as well as others who believe Luffy/crew's past two villains have been less than exemplory, take a closer look at Hodi and Caesar. For one, Hodi, a fishman by nature, who is ten times stronger than a human naturally, enduced by cursed power multiplying (on a fishman mind you), and fueled by a holy war against humanity for what they did to his race, fell to Luffy only after taking numerous haki imbued attacks, an explosive Gear Second Red Hawk, a Gear Third Elephant Gun, and ultimately a Gear Third Elepant Gatling. The battle, much of it underwater or at a disadvantage for Luffy, was so extrenuous for Luffy, that the Great White fishman nearly killed the future PK after chomping through the latter's shoulder. Can't believe I'm saying this, but thank you Jinbe.

    .....aannnnd I digress back into my rant lol.

    Furthermore, upon reaching Punk Hazard, the crew as a WHOLE, has been defeated once each, if not twice for some of them. Also remember that Caesar, a psychotic scientist bent on destroying the world (yes more so Vegapunk but he's willing to do anything to do so) and a logia who can manipulate the very gasses in the atmosphere and body and fuse with "Land of Death," fell once again after a sequence of haki imbued, enraged Luffy attacks, the final one being a newly promoted Gear Third Grizzly Magnum.

    Overall, I won't say the crew has gone all out in either arc. Not by any means. However, we have seen them struggle realistically, especially Luffy, which is how we gauge how far the crew in general has come thus far. Certainly, they MUST continue to grow and face greater opponents, they must develope their powers at a realistic pace. If they don't continue to fight increasingly powerful opponents, they will have what happened two years ago at Sabody happen again, which was one of the most shocking turn of events because it specifically illustrated how "lightweight" the SHs were. In this regard, I agree with you. Nevertheless, I disagree that Oda should push the story along for the simple sake of illustrating how powerful and PK worthy Luffy and crew are following two years, all for the purpose of expecting the PK and crew must be 100% victorious 100% of the time, not amazingly if not intelligently triumphant against 30% odds. Such a premise would rob us readers of an enjoyable and emotionally engaging story, where unsuspected revelations and outcomes are replaced by shoddy, underhyped and hollow victories.

    In conclusion and on a side note, the chapter exemplifies greatness on every level. I would like to thank everyone for reading; this has been a Word Riot by yours truly :p.
    Last edited by Blackriot69; 02-05-2013 at 09:23 PM.

  4. #14
    H+ xioaxioa's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackriot69 View Post
    You CANNOT have a manga whose premise exists in a group of protagonists overcoming unimaginable odds to ultimately reach an unthinkable treasure at the end immediately switch to being a one shot blow out of power each and every arc, where the villain obtains little evidence of their own power, the hero(s) wields unfathamable power to defeat them, and no story exists as to why the two face off in the first place.
    You should read the manga "One Punch Man".
    http://www.mangahere.com/manga/onepunch_man/

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  5. #15
    Senior Member Blackriot69's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xioaxioa View Post
    You should read the manga "One Punch Man".
    http://www.mangahere.com/manga/onepunch_man/
    ....Well, I suppose my theory goes out the window....Although, I'm not sure I'd consider that a good manga lmao.

    Also, Franky's hair has got to be the worst yet :/

  6. #16
    Hee Hee Hee XD aggeroff's Avatar
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    ^ First time I saw it I thought he had Unohana's hair
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  7. #17
    pirate hunter arisart's Avatar
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    Amazing chapter. The last page is so badass. So this settles it, Dofla uses "strings" as his power and he's effective against logias.

    Quote Originally Posted by Airicks View Post
    You can't seriously think Luffy could solo Flamingo right now...

    If he could that would put Luffy in the top 10 strongest guys in One Piece Universe, which would also mean Zoro would be too since how even Zoro/Luffy are.

    That cant be the case or this manga would get boring as hell.
    How could you even say that when we haven't seen the rest of the Yonkou's crew and the rest of the marines? I could easily think 10 guys who is stronger than Dofla.

    3 Admirals
    Garp
    4 yonkous
    Rayleigh
    Dragon

    Then we have the first mates of the Yonkous and Sengoku. There's also the possibility of really strong independent crews out there, the royal guards for the tenryubitto and Dragon's high ranking members. Dofla is up there sure, but I doubt he cracks the top ten.

    Based on how Dofla and Law(which I assume is at Luffy's level) handled Smoker, I think it's safe to say that Dofla is stronger but not that much as to say Luffy has no fighting chance.

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  8. #18
    Vongola Sun Guardian jio999's Avatar
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    Smoker is the chad of this manga now oh no.

  9. #19
    The Heropon! Sirxxx's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackriot69 View Post
    For two weeks now your arguments have been faceslap material.
    ...
    In conclusion and on a side note, the chapter exemplifies greatness on every level. I would like to thank everyone for reading; this has been a Word Riot by yours truly :p.
    Ok, First: You have to get your face checked out! Like, right now. Two weeks of abuse cannot be healthy for anyone's skin tone.

    And, Second: Well...they don't have to fight right now :-/

    I don't mind if Oda wants to take another 100 chapters to properly set up the confrontation (as he is so expertly doing now)--I still maintain that Luffy should meet Doflamingo in battle, and must be able to defeat him when he does.

    Otherwise, you're giving me two positions that I didn't take, and don't believe: That Oda should corrupt the pacing of the story, and that he should do so to have Luffy rOFLSTMP Doflamingo. I didn't say I wanted to see either of these things. I agree with you.So I can't even counter-argue because I didn't say what you...well, you get it.

    Each crewmember has not been defeated--they've been careless, and have succumbed to environmental hazards like terrible RPG characters. Yes, Luffy did overcome a VERY strong opponent in Hody and an incredibly lethal one in CC, but I would not call either case really struggling. When are we going to get another Zoro vs. Mr. 1? Usopp + Chopper vs. Mr. 4 and MerryChristmas? Nami vs. Kalifa? Luffy vs. Lucci?

    THAT was struggle. THAT was seeing protagonists overcome impossible odds. THAT was the magic.

    To be sure, the crew has been performing QUITE admirably! In fact, I would argue they have been 100% beasting 100% of the challenges they have faced since the timeskip. We're getting little of the stuff that made us fall in love with these characters: watching this family of wackjobs put everything they had--blood, bones, lives--on the line against people who should be able to wipe the floor with them. I don't want to see that change.

    There is plenty of story before, during, and, I'm sure, after Doflamingo. Strong as he is, he's small fry compared to the admirals and Yonkou--that has been readily certain. To be honest, if Luffy can't top him, he really should just quit right now and rent himself out as a bouncehouse at children's parties.

    P.S. Third: Your Bleach observation was spot-on lol.

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  10. #20
    Senior Member Airicks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by arisart View Post
    How could you even say that when we haven't seen the rest of the Yonkou's crew and the rest of the marines? I could easily think 10 guys who is stronger than Dofla.

    3 Admirals
    Garp
    4 yonkous
    Rayleigh
    Dragon

    Then we have the first mates of the Yonkous and Sengoku. There's also the possibility of really strong independent crews out there, the royal guards for the tenryubitto and Dragon's high ranking members. Dofla is up there sure, but I doubt he cracks the top ten.

    Based on how Dofla and Law(which I assume is at Luffy's level) handled Smoker, I think it's safe to say that Dofla is stronger but not that much as to say Luffy has no fighting chance.
    Well, during that post i was going to say 'top 15', but I started thinking about it... this is what I think (and why I think Flamingo is likely in the top 10, although probably 9th/10th spot)

    You can't assume there is a guy (or group of guys) in the shadows stronger then Flamingo in a 1 on 1 fight, because we've already seen many famous NW pirates during the War - none of which seems to come CLOSE to Flamingo, in feats OR prestige.

    Flamingo toyed with Josu, he chopped Oars Jr's leg off with seemly little difficulty, he manhandled the marines at Marine HQ before the war (I only say this because those Marines couldn't have been simple Privates, I have no proof other then it would make no sense for the WG to show weakness in front of the Warlords), he seemed to think he was strong enough to have Crocodile as a subordinate (which must had been on good footing since I don't see Flamingo as stupid), lastly, Law had to FIGHT Smoker, Law seemed to just bring him down (with the rest of the G-5) - it didn't seem like he was even out of breath.

    The only people who I would feel comfortable putting above Flamingo are.

    4Emporers
    Mihawk
    3 old Admirals
    Dragon (maybe, he has no feats - just going on prestige he is though)

    Garp is a grandpa, so is Rayleigh, in their day they may would had obliterated Flamingo but not now, Garp couldn't even free himself from Sengoku, Rayleigh couldn't save the SH's - before Kuma came the SH's would had really been captured/killed there.

    As Law said, Flamingo is the BIGGEST of the underground pirates, that's saying something, in the NW Vice Admirals are the enforcers for the WG, and Flamingo just trounced a G-5 VA, and the G-5 was said to be the most dangerous position for Marines in the NW.

    If you respond, let me ask you, do you think Flamingo is above Vergo? the Vergo which put fear into Smoker? (I'm making this point to say, if Vergo is a VA Hero and Flamingo is measurably stronger, what stops him from breaking into the top 10?)

    EDIT:

    I'd put Flamingo at about Marco's level, FROM WHAT WE'VE SEEN (I admit I could be over judging, but from everything we KNOW).
    Could Marco 1v1 a old Admiral? no, Could Marco fight a Admiral? yes.
    That's the same thing I think about Flamingo, I hope we see him trade blows with Aokiji (though I know it wont be a life/death fight, just enough to gauge is all I want)

    And I'd def put Marco in the top 15 in One Piece Universe, so Flamingo breaks the top 10.
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