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  1. #11
    Senior Member kuroihikari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Genesis 1.0 View Post
    I never thought Inuyasha should have cut off Sesshomaru' arm, that Goku should have defeated Vegeta, that Hiro should have won 90% of his fights, Butch shouldn't have killed Vincent, and the list goes on.

    Main characters have it rough.
    I don't get what you're trying to say with this.

    There are LOT of main characters, even in standard shounen-fare who win most of their fights convincingly and few chapters further in the story you're still convinced that it was a deserved win. Kyo from Samurai Deeper Kyo, Himura Kenshin, and the Black Cat, for example. Ichigo doesn't fall into that category, but like I said, I'll give him time. His "random power level" also gives Kubo a perfect rationale for writing Ichigo like that.

    And oh, you honestly didn't expect Goku to beat the pulp out of Vegeta, discounting a Vegeta power-up? That was the entire purpose of his training. Never read Inu Yasha nor those one with Butch and Hiro, so don't know about that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Hand Banana View Post
    Ya but if you look at his fmajor fights it really should been draws.

    His fight with Renji in SS left him pretty fucked up. He barely won that.

    His fight with Kenpachi was a tie. Because Kenpachi was still conscious while Ichigo was out for a day or two.

    His fight with Byakuya was only a win in defeating his pride. Physically Byakuya was still able to fight.

    His fight with grimmjaw which took him like twice was finally won because orihime used her name chant spell to raise his defense and luck by like over 70%

    His fight with that four arm dude would of been a L since they covered orihime's mouth. Had she been able to scream out his name she would of boosted his defense and luck.

    That emo bat dude same thing. orihime used her chant spell and increased it by 100 fold.

    So you can expect all his big victories will be due to the results of orihime opening her big fucking mouth. Chad's semi death brink and four eyes semi death defeat did nothing to really encourage him. Take orihime out the equation and bingo! Ichigo is dead.
    I'm gonna compromise: I didn't say he should've lost, and a draw is still a non-win .

  2. #12
    Senior Member Yondaime123's Avatar
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    Mm Hagane if you think about it,if Ichigo won all of this fights,then the manga would already be over,wouldn't it be like that?Also for the last part with How Ichigo goes with his new power-up(the mask ofc) and making one attack and then bam he is down,Ichigo already explained to Unohana in the garganta about his reiatsu-he knew that Rukia and co were in trouble and never got there with full strenght.Also notice that Yammy is #0 for something.

  3. #13
    Prick List: Gaara, Bee Genesis 1.0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kuroihikari View Post
    I don't get what you're trying to say with this.

    There are LOT of main characters, even in standard shounen-fare who win most of their fights convincingly and few chapters further in the story you're still convinced that it was a deserved win. Kyo from Samurai Deeper Kyo, Himura Kenshin, and the Black Cat, for example. Ichigo doesn't fall into that category, but like I said, I'll give him time. His "random power level" also gives Kubo a perfect rationale for writing Ichigo like that.

    And oh, you honestly didn't expect Goku to beat the pulp out of Vegeta, discounting a Vegeta power-up? That was the entire purpose of his training. Never read Inu Yasha nor those one with Butch and Hiro, so don't know about that.



    I'm gonna compromise: I didn't say he should've lost, and a draw is still a non-win .
    Meh, you didn't really answer my point so much as list counter-points that seem to be equal, therefore cancelling the whole thing. I can dredge up just as many incidents where main characters struggle often as you can ones where they usually win in definitive fashion.

    Like I said, the joys of being a main character.


    As to Goku / Vegeta, oh shizzle, don't even get me started on that shiz again. I've literally posted pages of heat with this over the years.

    Suffice it to say Vegeta clearly owned that initial encounter when he went to his true Saiyan form and was crushing a beaten and depleted Goku that he'd beat the brakes off of. It took a throwaway chracter managing to cut his tail off and subsequent BS for Goku to even survive, much less win.

    If there was ever anything more broken in the history of shounen, it was Goku's recurring power upgrades that surpassed others of the same blood and even those with greater power.

    Majin Vegeta clearly was owning Goku, without a f'n doubt an then the Hax Hammer falls and everything from there to SSJ4 goes to shit fo Vegeta. They turn him into a f'n wimp and slap a 'character development' label on it.

    Development? Fuck off.

    "For I being a poor man, have only my dreams & I have spread them beneath your feet. Tread carefully, for you tread upon my dreams."

  4. #14
    Full Member shoe's Avatar
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    it should be noted that he only beat grimmjow thanks to two out of nowhere powerups that still have to be explained, and that he also got another such power-up when fighting ulqs unreleased form.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by shoe View Post
    it should be noted that he only beat grimmjow thanks to two out of nowhere powerups that still have to be explained, and that he also got another such power-up when fighting ulqs unreleased form.
    Two out of nowhere powerups to beat Grimmjow? I know the first one, the "I can hold my Vizard form for hours now instead of 11 seconds" in the fight. What was the second one? Or are you counting the "Orihime said my name" powerup near the end of the fight as the second one?

  6. #16
    7 Months Left ammada™'s Avatar
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    Ichigo isn't overrated, he likes Luffy, he's in a category between Naruto "down graded"
    & Himura Kenshin, Train Hearnet (these are overrated)

  7. #17
    ɹǝʎʍɐן Я I Hand Banana's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by amma2006 View Post
    Ichigo isn't overrated, he likes Luffy, he's in a category between Naruto "down graded"
    & Himura Kenshin, Train Hearnet (these are overrated)
    So now he went from being overrated to being gay?

  8. #18
    7 Months Left ammada™'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hand Banana View Post
    So now he went from being overrated to being gay?
    It seems so.

  9. #19
    When he defeated Zaraki Kenpachi, I thought that he only won because he cut through Zaraki's sword. Zaraki had only just taken his patch off. Zaraki also was not yet capable of first release, which did not work well against Ichigo's somewhat unique sword.

    As for his victory against Byakugan, I think that was due to lack of resolve to kill by Byakugan. One or two well placed Kido spells by a master like Byakugan should have made it easy. Not to mention that Ichigo was able destroy his emperor sword. He has a tendancy to severely injure, but not kill certain opponents. He left Ichigo alive at the beginning of the story. Renji got slaughtered, but was still left alive. It seems as though he could have easily defeated Ichigo on the hill if he wished. All times with a "healer" conveniently nearby that a captain would surely be able to sense.

    Basically, I think he has finally reached a level where he could defeat a few of the captains, but I have my doubts that he is yet capable of defeating the more elite captains.

  10. #20
    Senior Member kuroihikari's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by solidsphere View Post
    As for his victory against Byakugan, I think that was due to lack of resolve to kill by Byakugan.
    See? Ichigo's so overrated, he even transcends manga.

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