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  1. #601
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    Chad, orihime, and ishida were pretty much mindset on going.. And they knew he was leaving.. I mean, why do you think yoruichi trained chad and orihime.. and ishida did the whole glove thing... Plus, i dont think ichigo was that surprised they were coming this first time.. I mean, it was urahara that called all of them.

    Are you sure you arent mixing up the 1st and 2nd trips? The HM one i believe ichigo might not have thought they were going to come with him because of the power gap in between them.. Although i think he was more set on going by himself because rukia and renji were ordered not to go and ishida had lost his powers and couldnt hang out with shinigami and chad was considered weak by ichigo.. But the first time i dont think they had the "going alone" aspect.. maybe for a bit after losing his powers (i dont think so, though, but cant remember if that was there) but certainly they got rid of that pretty fast...

  2. #602
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    No, I am not mixing things up. Ichigo was intent on going alone to save Rukia, because he thought it was his fault she was abducted on the grounds that he failed to protect her. Ishida knew, but considering Ichigo's and Ishida's relationship Ichigo couldn't count on him to actually bother. You also have to remember that Ichigo's character is written in such a way that he always thinks that it is his reponsiblity alone to do things. That's just how main protagonists in shounen are written, because the point with shounen is to show how the character grows in learning how to accept help from others (friends).

    They were training independently unaware of each other doing so. Urahara and Yoruichi set them up because Urahara needed a way to retrieve the hogukyoku, that's why Urahara apologized to Ichigo when they came back from Soul Society. Uarahara and Yoruichi might've told Ishida, Chad and Orihime, but Ichigo did not know about them, that was the point.

    When they saw each other after the final day at school, they said that they were going on their own trips. That's why it also became more of an adventure, because it appears as highly unplanned and random.
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  3. #603
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    Well, ichigo sure as hell wasnt surprised to see them at uraharas place.. so he must have known they were coming before then. He may have originally planned to go alone, but i believe he somehow heard that the others were going to come to.. And he really wasnt opposed to them coming along..

    In fact, ichigo probably was planning on going alone to begin with.. just because he wouldnt want others in danger.. But he didnt care if the others were going to come along, he probably secretly wanted them too, thats why he never really said that they couldnt come. But yeah, he knew they were going to come along.. although he might not have learned that til he was training with urahara to get his shinigami powers back, or to learn fighting skill or around then.

  4. #604
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    Of course he secretely wanted them to come along, but he was unable to express that

    I have to reread this now when you said he didn't seem surprised though.
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  5. #605
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    I'm gonna ask the question thats probably been asked 3 dozen times over again but does anyone at this point doubt that the top 4 Espada (1-4) Are Vasto Lordes?


    - Considering the fact that Aizen himself expressed disappointment in the top 3 Espada as he expected their powers to surpass his own. Could anything less than a VL surpass Aizen and fight on par with 2 of the oldest captains?

    - After watching the anime it seems pretty clear if it was not for the Vizards the Captains would have been crushed on their own with the exception of Yamo. Plus I dont see what importance a VL could have into story now that Aizen has transformed into something far beyond...personally I think its a done deal 1-4 plus retard boy are VL's.


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  6. #606
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    Personal opinion here pow, but id say they werent VLs.. Just because if so, there wouldnt be much good fights with hollows anymore in the story.. Plus, i wonder if even aizen could tell if a hollow is a VL or adjuchas... Id have to say they were most likely powerful adjuchas (the strongest he could find) that he just assumed were VL because of their power. The only thing i dont understand is, if there is a VL or VLs right now, why havent any of the hollows/aizen/SS heard about them yet.. I think an extremely powerful hollow should be well known, no?

    Although, in your 2nd statement is something there that makes me think otherwise.. I mean, 5 (or was it 10?) VL were supposed to be able to completely destroy SS, yet.. 2-3 Aizen could probably do it with ease...(Although, if someone's prediction of aizen turning himself into a VL is correct, then i guess it would be somewhat accurate) So if ichigo beats him by himself, he would be able to easily take on a VL.. which means that pretty much every character but like.. royal guards and like 5 others would end up useless.. Although, kubo could just end up saying that it was a mistake on the shinigami's calculation or something.. but it certainly does seem that aizen is stronger than VL right now, so having VL enter wouldnt make much of a threat after this arc. Although, there could be "stronger" and "weaker" VLs.. in which case 5 "weaker ones" could take SS down.. which fixes Kubo's mistake.. So really, i dont see why this would truly be a huge problem.

    Although another problem would be the power gap in between the Captains and the VL.. if the strongest adjuchas gave the captains so much trouble.. Even with their bankais and whatnot, theyd need minimum 2-3 captains to take down a VL, which is kinda correct.. But itd be weird to see team battles in Bleach all the time. But again, such a thing is easily fixable..

    So I'd say no, those were not VL's. As I mentioned earlier, it would take the hollow side pretty much completely out of the story...



    Now heres a question.. Do you think a lot of the shinigamis/ichigo's friends in the story would receive a power-up of some sort if ichigo beats aizen by himself? I mean, if he does, that pretty much makes him 2x stronger than everyone.. but the captain-commander.. Unless it is some fluke thing, though. Although, we dont really know the full power of 3 of the captains.. but most of the other ones would need a boost if they want to stay in the story. :-/ Although, itd be a good opportunity to kill a few captains off.. like dog-captain who seems to have no one related to him anymore.. >.>

  7. #607
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    As I said Pow, I think we must rethink the definition of a VL. I do not think any of the espada were VL.
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  8. #608
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    Quote Originally Posted by POW View Post
    I'm gonna ask the question thats probably been asked 3 dozen times over again but does anyone at this point doubt that the top 4 Espada (1-4) Are Vasto Lordes?


    - Considering the fact that Aizen himself expressed disappointment in the top 3 Espada as he expected their powers to surpass his own. Could anything less than a VL surpass Aizen and fight on par with 2 of the oldest captains?

    - After watching the anime it seems pretty clear if it was not for the Vizards the Captains would have been crushed on their own with the exception of Yamo. Plus I dont see what importance a VL could have into story now that Aizen has transformed into something far beyond...personally I think its a done deal 1-4 plus retard boy are VL's.
    when did aizen say that he expected that the top 3 espadas powers would surpass his own?

  9. #609
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    Quote Originally Posted by halaros536 View Post
    when did aizen say that he expected that the top 3 espadas powers would surpass his own?





    Its implied he expected their powers to be greater than his own shingami power at least.


    *Also note the idea of the VL was that they where stronger than an average Captain but we get that info from Hitsu who probably has never seen a VL and was only speculating.

    They did mop the floor with most of the captains until the Vizards showed up.


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  10. #610
    Legendary Member halaros536's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by POW View Post





    Its implied he expected their powers to be greater than his own shingami power at least.


    *Also note the idea of the VL was that they where stronger than an average Captain but we get that info from Hitsu who probably has never seen a VL and was only speculating.

    They did mop the floor with most of the captains until the Vizards showed up.
    he knew that he would be stronger than them one on one but he couldnt imagine that he wouldnt be stronger than all of them together thats what he means.

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