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  • No.

    9,008 99.67%
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  • Maybe

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  1. #6081
    Senior Member paulbee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    Well yeah, Kakashi can't manage that, but if he was by chance fighting in a thunderstorm...
    Well that's the point if Kirin requires no chakra use except Chidori, then.......

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  2. #6082
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by paulbee View Post
    Well that's the point if Kirin requires no chakra use except Chidori, then.......
    I think the original debate was whether or not Kirin utilized a form of Natural Energy to gather the strength of the environment, which I contested, stating that it was more similar to how a water or earth-style user might use the presence of a lake, the ground, etc to perform their techniques.

    Kakashi could probably perform Kirin if he's skilled enough, because it doesn't involve a large amount of chakra, and therefore doesn't conflict with Kakashi's notoriously low chakra levels. However, as stated, Kakashi can't reliably create a thunderstorm.

  3. #6083
    Senior Member Afro Thunda's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    I think the original debate was whether or not Kirin utilized a form of Natural Energy to gather the strength of the environment, which I contested, stating that it was more similar to how a water or earth-style user might use the presence of a lake, the ground, etc to perform their techniques.
    No Natural Energy used or required. Only pure, unbridled force of Nature itself. And the right conditions to execute the technique in the first place (huge thunderstorm). Also,

    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    Kakashi's notoriously low chakra levels.
    Methinks even that is debatable nowadays. After all, he compared his chakra levels to Naruto's, which, when you think about it, kinda isn't a great gauge at all considering Naruto has tons upon tons. His levels are low compared to Naruto's, but that certainly doesn't indicate that he's lacking in the chakra department. Alas though, that is off topic.

  4. #6084
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Afro Thunda View Post
    No Natural Energy used or required. Only pure, unbridled force of Nature itself. And the right conditions to execute the technique in the first place (huge thunderstorm). Also,

    Methinks even that is debatable nowadays. After all, he compared his chakra levels to Naruto's, which, when you think about it, kinda isn't a great gauge at all considering Naruto has tons upon tons. His levels are low compared to Naruto's, but that certainly doesn't indicate that he's lacking in the chakra department. Alas though, that is off topic.
    It's true that the *real* explanation for his poor stamina is that the Sharingan (and especially Mangekyou) drains him particularly fast as a non-Uchiha. Still, it's been a key component of his fighting style (up until this war, at least) that he has to end things quickly for exactly that reason. He died of chakra exhaustion fighting Pain, and didn't even really perform that many techniques compared to most high-level ninjas.

    Everyone wonders why/How Kakashi is still fightning and spamming Kamui against Tobi. I think he had enough offscreen time to take it easy and recover his chakra. My hope is that chilling inside Naruto's Kyuubi cloak also had some restorative properties.

  5. #6085
    Senior Member knife eater's Avatar
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    @rlin, escaping the tsukiyomi was an involuntary side effect of orochimaru's power emerging while sasuke was in the illusion. Zetsu assumed it was merely sasuke's sharingan. Cursed seal appeared to be the trigger but i doubt it will ever be fully explained. When reading the fight again it's clear sasuke didn't will himself free with his sharingan like zetsu assumed. Zetsu more than once in his mono-dialogue play by play had to correct himself when things were not as they appeared.

    As for sasuke and the power from nature. Well, i meant nature in a broader sense than restricted to gathering natural energy the way taught by the toad sages. The kirin technique just appears to me as a foreshadowing of a deeper relationship with natural forces. W I never said the lightning strike was performed in a "sage mode" sense. I think it shows sasuke's willingness to utelize a greater power from the outside and natural forces don't necessarily have to be limited to the "sage mode" approach. That being said, it seems the gathering of natural energy into chakra seems to be a requirement for realizing the ultimate power so6p had. I doubt kishi will introduce more than "sage mode" for such forces so sasuke will likely end up learning a method congruent to how we know it works already. I meant to present the idea of using the elements or raw power of nature as the foreshadowing and precursor to natural energy/sage chakra.
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  6. #6086
    Senior Member psukkar's Avatar
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    dont u guys recall from part 1, Gai said Kahashi split a thunder bolt with Raiki.

    As for fighing in a thunderstorm lol, The raikages got this no problem lol.
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  7. #6087
    Yesss... Rlinfamous's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by psukkar View Post
    dont u guys recall from part 1, Gai said Kahashi split a thunder bolt with Raiki.

    As for fighing in a thunderstorm lol, The raikages got this no problem lol.
    When did this become a contest over who *can* fight in a Thunderstorm? XD the point was who can *create* one and use it!

  8. #6088
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rlinfamous View Post
    When did this become a contest over who *can* fight in a Thunderstorm? XD the point was who can *create* one and use it!
    Well, seemingly you would need to use a powerful fire jutsu (which in the Manga version, Kakashi can't use) and a few times at that, which would have to hit the clouds (if there is no clouds, then there wouldn't be any thunderstorm dragon/beast as well), if you wanted to create a thunderstorm. On the other hand if there existed a thunderstorm, he might have been able to do it, but, well I can't remember ever seeing ninja fighting in a Thunderstorm, in this series, beside fillers. I guess it's simply too risky and too disadvantageous if you had bad luck and met an A/S class lightning ninja in it... of course ninje are fighting in rain, but that is all (you still would need to use the fire tech to create thunderstorm).

    The only people that really could use this tactic as much as they wanted, were Nagato (since gathering clouds and making them rain non-stop, was done by him on a daily basis (?), not to mention that he could use all elements thank to Rinnegan, thus he could be a real Thunder God of this series) and So6p (for the same reasons, but simply controlling gravity is just more impressive ;P).

    Ah right, it's need mentioning that Kakashi's version would have been named Rajin (or Rajiuu IIRC ? It was a while since I last played some SMT).

    On the other hand, Sasuke hasn't used Kirin since the time he lost CS...



  9. #6089
    Konjiki Ashisogi Jizō Daemon Spade's Avatar
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    Based on what has happened in the latest chapter, who's Sharigan abilities would you most like to have?

    Madara: we still dont know the full extent, but I'll state and assume the following: Giant/multi-face-arm Susano! Thats all we really know. Everything else could be a result of Hashirama's genes. Mass clone Susanoo, meteor......???? Phashing into the earth, giant forrest mukuton, deadly jungle flower jutsu?? Sorry I dont know the actual names, but you get the point. What does Madara's EMS do?

    Itachi: I'm assuming the 2nd best Genjutsu, Tsyukiomi(sp). Amaterasu, Yata's Mirror, Sword of Totsuka.

    Saskue: Advanced Genjutsu, Advanced Amaterasu, Multiple Susanoo forms.

    Shisui: #1 Uchiha Genjutsu user.

    Obito: Space-time user in both eyes! (Susanoo, Amaterasu, Tsyukiomi, Genjutsu?????)
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  10. #6090
    Senior Member Zero's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Daemon Spade View Post
    Based on what has happened in the latest chapter, who's Sharigan abilities would you most like to have?

    Madara: we still dont know the full extent, but I'll state and assume the following: Giant/multi-face-arm Susano! Thats all we really know. Everything else could be a result of Hashirama's genes. Mass clone Susanoo, meteor......???? Phashing into the earth, giant forrest mukuton, deadly jungle flower jutsu?? Sorry I dont know the actual names, but you get the point. What does Madara's EMS do?

    Itachi: I'm assuming the 2nd best Genjutsu, Tsyukiomi(sp). Amaterasu, Yata's Mirror, Sword of Totsuka.

    Saskue: Advanced Genjutsu, Advanced Amaterasu, Multiple Susanoo forms.

    Shisui: #1 Uchiha Genjutsu user.

    Obito: Space-time user in both eyes! (Susanoo, Amaterasu, Tsyukiomi, Genjutsu?????)
    I'm not sure if what you said is correct...

    All jutsu previously possible of being casted from a normal Sharingan, probably gain an additional boost in potency (confirmed for casting basic Sharingan illusion).

    To awaken Susanoo you need to first master 2 MS jutsu (a MS jutsu is distinguished by having a God's name), even then it is quite rare.

    1) Madara | Specialization - Unknown (probably Ninjutsu) || Additional Information - The first known MS & EMS |
    Susanoo, which in turn means he posses a 2 MS jutsu that we don't know about. It's possible that the Rinnegan's Chakra Absorbtion jutsu, was one of the MS jutsu he awakened, since MS is closely related to Rinnegan, thus awakening a degraded, or only one of the Rinnegan's justu could be possible.

    2) Izuna | Specialization - Unknown || Additional Information - The second or ex aequo first known MS |
    There is no additional information in accordance to what jutsu his MS possessed, or if he even was able to manifest Susanoo.

    3) Itachi | Specialization - Genjutsu (Tsukuyomi) & Ninjutsu (Amaterasu) || Additional Information - The only known MS possessing double specialization |
    Susanoo, it's weapon is a reflection of Itachi's stronger specialization - the Sword of Tosuka - a sword that entraps and forever seals the target in an eternal genjutsu, while his second specialization is shown through the impenetrable shield - the Yata Mirror (check details somewhere else ).

    4) Sasuke | Specialization - Ninjutsu (Amaterasu & Kagutsuchi) || Additional Information - The second known EMS |
    Susanoo, similar to Itachi's case, Amaterasu is the source for the shield, while Kagutsuchi composes it's specialized weapon.

    5) Shisui | Specialization - Genjutsu (Kotoamatsukami & ?/Kotoamatsukami?) || Additional Information - MS boasting supreme genjutsu capabilities |
    It is suggested that Danzou was able to cast a special MS Genjutsu from the eye he stole from Shisui. It is unknown if it was Kotoamatsukami or another MS Genjutsu, yet it is confirmed that Kotoamatsukami is Shisui's strongest Genjutsu. There is no information regarding awakening Susanoo.

    6) Obito | Specialization - Ninjutsu (Kamui & ?/The Power of Demons\Demon Being - let's call it that for now ) || Additional Information - MS solely based on Time-Space Ninjutsu |
    It is unknown if both eyes could only cast Kamui, but most likely there are 2 different jutsu (Kamui used by Kakashi and the Other One used by Tobi). There is no information regarding awakening Susanoo.

    The mentioned Susanoo Form, is the one which complete weapons. I made it short, you can search for additional information yourselves.



    Answer nr 6 - Obito's MS, since being capable of moving myself and everything that is in contact with me to another dimension, plus transporting everything I see to another dimension with the other eye, would probably make me a boss ... that is if I had enough chakra to spam those .



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