Does Everyone Have the Right to Complain?

[Whitebeard]

@Franky: I do agree its a little hard to generalize everyone as a Bush fan, especially since his approval ratings are so incredibly low. But you must admit that we are kind of guilty for having him elected TWICE in the first place. You can't completely blame other countries for looking at us the way they do now. And of course I'm not dissing every American, and its as wrong to generalize everyone here as it is to generalize Iraqis and call them all the same. But was kind of a blunder to allow Bush and Cheyne another chance.

P.S. random fact, but does anyone else think Cheyne is hiding something....the guy shoots people in the face and keeps a man-sized Safe in his room...no joke...

[Franky]

@Franky: I do agree its a little hard to generalize everyone as a Bush fan, especially since his approval ratings are so incredibly low. But you must admit that we are kind of guilty for having him elected TWICE in the first place. You can't completely blame other countries for looking at us the way they do now. And of course I'm not dissing every American, and its as wrong to generalize everyone here as it is to generalize Iraqis and call them all the same. But was kind of a blunder to allow Bush and Cheyne another chance.

P.S. random fact, but does anyone else think Cheyne is hiding something....the guy shoots people in the face and keeps a man-sized Safe in his room...no joke...

Whitebeard: just b/c 51% of America voted for him twice has no bearing on the beliefs of the other 49%! It's not like I all sudden "fell in line with party politics". No, I kept the dialogue open and continued to show my INCREDIBLE disapproval of our current White House administration. Incidentally, my state went BLUE (democratic) in BOTH elections (as did NY if I am not mistaken); therefore, do preach to me about electing him. The electoral college is an old, dilapidated system that needs an overhaul. After all, Gore won the popular election, yet lost in the electoral college...how the f*ck is that democracy?! Also, how the hell are you preaching to me about politics when YOU DON'T EVEN VOTE! When you come of age and have the other ball drop, then talk politics. Till then, educate yourself and pipe down. If you don't vote, then you don't deserve to bitch and complain. Even I hate the 2 party politic machine, but even though picking the lesser of two evils is a pitiful choice...I still have a choice and I make it. Because my state often goes blue, I vote for 3rd party members that speak out against the modern political system b/c we need more choices.

Yes, Cheney is hiding something...the whole administration is trying desperately to distance itself from the current administration (first Powell, then that jackass Rumsfeld, now Rove amongst others). I think poor Mr. Bush is a victim of his own stupidity and that he has been so jaded by those around him that he has lost touch on all reality and actually BELIEVES what he is doing is right. All the while, he and his cronies are making bundles of money off of war profiteering.

[gela]

We have a right to complain when your country affects our homes.

I realise that not all americans are idots. But the fact is, that there are some stupid people running your country; and the citizens voted him in.

When you a country decides that they are going to have such a global impact, then you should expect to be judged globally.

I understand that all the steriotypes arn't true- and that its stupid to accuse single americans for world politics; but we are allowed to accuse your country and your polititions. Same as your allowed to accuse my country and our polititions.. if you new anything about them. (Btw Im Australian.. and im more critical of my own country aswell)

So, I dont think we have a right to judge your society - and steriotype you

but we can judge your global doings.


btw, off topic (kinda); we had a thing on TV where some guys went to america, and showed random people on the street a world map with Australia and Iraqu's names swapped around; and when asked to point out Iraqu ALL off them pointed to Australia.

[Archiel]

Two things first

I love seeing Australians in our country and talk with them frequently; I think on a whole they travel more than any other society and are enriched for it.

Yay for Autralians, don't know why we travel so much, guess we just have a lot of spare time.

btw, off topic (kinda); we had a thing on TV where some guys went to america, and showed random people on the street a world map with Australia and Iraqu's names swapped around; and when asked to point out Iraqu ALL off them pointed to Australia.

I think I watched it, or it might've just be Chaser's War

Anyways on topic, any misconceptions or negative opinions I have about the US or other nations is usually based on what I get from the media, being negative and highlighting a nations weaknesses are a speciality and while sometimes its justified bombrding people with that stuff (especially when some of it is false) can give people the wrong mindset.

Although since I'm from Australia instead of hating the US it seem like I should be more hateful to the British (not serious hate, just a rivalry sort of thing), sports would be a good example, it feels really good when we beat the british in some sort of competition.
Going off topic so I think I'll stop now.

[Franky]

@gela: nice points. I guess, as someone who voted TWICE against that retard and have spoken out against his politics on countless occasions, I'll just have to eat crow.

One other point. The US is by far and away the number 1 philanthropic nation (btwn Gates and Buffet alone that's a sh*t load more than the most of the world), yet I never really hear about it b/c of our "fearless leader", f*cked up foreign policy, and corruption...too bad. More than I can say for a lot of the other capable nations. Not to mention our non-profit organizations (room-2-read, heffer, etc.,).

Speaking of NPO's, turns out that most of the donations come from our religious organizations...hmm, that's is a little strange and brings this topic around to religious zealots. Really quick on religion. I understand the role of religion and its role in society, but it has gotten to the point that I really think it needs to step out of the political realm once and for all. I mean, haven't we learned that religion/war/politics all go hand-in-hand. I am not just talking about the American Christian right (aka the "Bible Belt" or "the South"), but all fundamental religious organizations and their ties to any type of gov't. I guess that is asking WAY too much of the world...

Here's to the rest of the world:

[Kazuma]

i have to agree with the person that said many Americans aren't used to differences in many areas. No actually, i can say that they tend to not care about the differences in other areas that someone else has. Some don't even care about the differences in the world in general.

Ask a few black people in states like Georgia, Alabama, or Mississippi what their problems and compare it to the answers you get in states like New York, Cali, or Washington. While some small underline themes are the same (jobs, education), the scope of those things changes with where you live here.

In the same way, i can have a conversation with a Few Caucasian people in New York, and feel like i'm speaking to people that actually care about the input. But in a state like...uh....Utah, I meet with general fear of "what i am."

This wasn't to bring a It's white vs black here in America so yeah i can complain thing. No, More so that i have found, people in America only tend to care about the scope of things that directly affect them. I've lived in 9 different cities in 9 separate states, and The only places that i consider "liveable" for me, are the ones that are large cities. The smaller the city, the less the people in set city care about the things that happen outside of the city. Americans that i've talked to are so content in the belief that all they need to do live and pay taxes and everything will be ok. Just like someone else said, some of them don't even have a general clue where other countries in the world are, sometimes even continents. Heck some of them don't even know where some of the states in the country are.

[gela]

@gela: nice points. I guess, as someone who voted TWICE against that retard and have spoken out against his politics on countless occasions, I'll just have to eat crow.

if it makes you feel any better, our government is retarded aswell

[shaggyjebus]

Kazuma just made me think about something with his post, about knowing or not knowing where places are.

Does it really matter if I don't know exactly where Amsterdam is? Now, not knowing if it's a country or a city, that is important (and that confusion has happened before), but does it really matter if I know where the place is? I could not be sure where Jupiter is, but it doesn't matter because I'm never going to go to Jupiter. And on the off chance that I am going to go there, I'm definitely going to research it and its location before I go. Is there any need to know it beforehand if I'm not going to go there or have anything to do with it?

I'm just asking for opinions, but I seriously don't think it matters if I know where Egypt is or I don't, or if I know whether Australia is southeast or southwest from America. I'm not planning to ever go there, and like I said, if I do end up going there, I'm going to research it beforehand. Is it really a big deal?

[gela]

Kazuma just made me think about something with his post, about knowing or not knowing where places are.

Does it really matter if I don't know exactly where Amsterdam is? Now, not knowing if it's a country or a city, that is important (and that confusion has happened before), but does it really matter if I know where the place is? I could not be sure where Jupiter is, but it doesn't matter because I'm never going to go to Jupiter. And on the off chance that I am going to go there, I'm definitely going to research it and its location before I go. Is there any need to know it beforehand if I'm not going to go there or have anything to do with it?

I'm just asking for opinions, but I seriously don't think it matters if I know where Egypt is or I don't, or if I know whether Australia is southeast or southwest from America. I'm not planning to ever go there, and like I said, if I do end up going there, I'm going to research it beforehand. Is it really a big deal?

please don't take this offensively, Im not attacking you, but..

not knowing the continents makes you seem ignorant, and a self centred country. Other countries think that America see themselves as the center of the world, and the fact that you don't even know where other countries are on a map only supports this theory.

Not knowing where other countries are, translates into you not caring about other countries. Although I supose you could say that it doesn't matter, because your never planning on going there.. thats just a matter of opinion.

Its pretty bad when Americans can't even point out Iraq on a map. If you know so little about the country, how can you make educated decisions on who's policies on war to vote for?

When the country knows nothing about a war they are involved in, just means that the president can do whatever he wants, without restraint, or having to worry about being voted out because of his decisions.

[shaggyjebus]

please don't take this offensively, Im not attacking you, but..

not knowing the continents makes you seem ignorant, and a self centred country. Other countries think that America see themselves as the center of the world, and the fact that you don't even know where other countries are on a map only supports this theory.

Not knowing where other countries are, translates into you not caring about other countries. Although I supose you could say that it doesn't matter, because your never planning on going there.. thats just a matter of opinion.

Its pretty bad when Americans can't even point out Iraq on a map. If you know so little about the country, how can you make educated decisions on who's policies on war to vote for?

When the country knows nothing about a war they are involved in, just means that the president can do whatever he wants, without restraint, or having to worry about being voted out because of his decisions.

I meant, what if any person doesn't know where some place is, not just Americans.

I will agree that it makes one look ignorant, but then again, not being good with math makes a person look ignorant, but it doesn't change the fact that some people hate math or aren't good at it or only want to know enough to get them by. The same would apply with geography. As for America seeming self-centered . . . honestly, you hit the nail right on the head, and no one can argue with it. America is self-centered, and America does see itself as the best (do you know how many times I hear "America's the best country in the world" from people?). We're egocentric, not caring about other cultures or traditions or histories. And we may not know much about Iraq, but I think a lot of people who don't go to school (in the working force, I mean) don't get any information besides what comes on the news, which says how many people died and some stuff that happened and shows a small picture of Iraq and Iran and other places other there. I've never seen an informative portion of the news where they taught you where countries are in relation to the rest of the world. This lack of easy knowledge, combined with the lack of interest in learning, combined with the crappy school system we have all across the country, and finally combined with the egocentricism, makes the US dumb (in the eyes of others). However, it is still possible to make an informed decision involving Iraq and Bush and our troops because we hear other things on the news, like how many people died and how the resistances aren't backing down and all that other stuff that essentially says that we're not going to win that "war." Right now, the president can do whatever he wants, and there is nothing we can do to stop him. His approval ratings are down the toilet, everyone's waiting for his term to end, and people are bashing him all over the places. The majority of Americans don't respect the man and want him gone, but the people don't get to vote on whether to stay in Iraq or not.

In short, I think it is possible for one to make decisions about something even if the locations are not known. If I'm blind, I can still tell that it's a bad idea to play baseball in front of a house with a lot of glass windows. Likewise, even if I don't know where China is, hypothetically, I can still tell you that it's a bad idea to go over there and try to get rid of communism in the country. (Damn, those Chinese are tough. You do not want to mess with them. )