Awesome points and a good response towards these new theories, but:
Originally Posted by Aga bomBa
Don't undermine others theories just because they don't match with yours. You're starting to sound like "OMG GUYS STOP BELIEVING WHAT I DONT!!!!". Kishi does so good in playing with the reader's mind, so you really can't blame if someone has a theory that's different from others, even if it's absurd. It's Anime/Manga. It's already absurd. Anything can happen. So please..please quit being a
Originally Posted by Aga bomBa
@paulbee, What do you think will happen between tobi and madara now that madara is off to collect the 9 tails at the same time tobi is already appearing to summon the 10 tails?
In light of the pages you linked I'm still too tempted to keep orochimaru around; important to current events involving madara, tobi, and infinite tsukiyomi. Tobi explains the power of hashirama did not come easy and that madara suffered a dubious defeat to get a piece of that power. Orochimaru got his hands on that power and we ended up with yamato and frankendanzo and frankenedodara. He got those cells and madaras from somebody (madara, pre tobi) and could have also played a role in tobi's origin. The timeline is forever fudged with errors but works with most events if you grease it up. I wont say now madara isn't affiliated with tobi but orochimaru OS certainly affiliated with both. Some of that is now in kabuto's hands and if there is any doubt orochimaru or kabuto didn't have their own angle to swindle in at anytime; kabuto's recent flashback and his own grandiose claims of being the new sage of six paths puts his interests in opposition to infinite tsukiyomi, a technique performed by another claiming to be the next sage. IM going to settle down the orochimaru stuff until after we see what sasuke learns from him.
Oooh don't get me wrong; I have always respected people's theories.. but this Tobi = Orochimaru is simple a very, stupid ass theory :)
Originally Posted by [JUiCE]
- There is soo many proofs and evidence given in the manga that Tobi can't be Orochimaru,.. and too be honest; what's your fckin point?? " OMG GUYS STOP BELIEVING WHAT I DONT "? Bro, I don't care if people don't believe what I'm saying is correct or not, that's what we're doing here: having discussions about the manga. Everyone is free to believe in what he wants and if someone finds my shit bizar and stupid, he has the right to say that.. I love it when people are straight and honest with me.
If I simple don't like his theory ( a theory which has been proven wrong, with all the manga proof ) and see that 5 pages are full of Tobi = Orochimaru, then yea: I had the need to say that it's a stupid ass theory, just like how you called me a stupid ass for saying it. Do you got any " Juice " theory in my mind which you want to tell us, or are you in the trade union as a spokesman for people with stupid ass theories ;)
Don't say stuff like " you're starting to sound like ", when I just asked him please to stop with that theory, gave manga proof that it couldn't be Tobi = Orochimaru.. simple as that. Come on Juice, you know me longer then this..
I still believe that Tobi is Madara's creation.. but what I'm starting to believe is: Both Madara and Tobi want to carry out the Moon Eye's Plan, but WHAT IF Tobi made plans for his own during the last years, and is changing it up?? Madara wants the Kyuubi and Tobi tries to take on Naruto and Bee with reviving the Juubi??
- That's what I meant by: their sharingan's aren't linked.. because Madara wouldn't say stuff like; it's time to collect Kyuubi, if he saw through Tobi's sharingan that Tobi is trying to own Naruto / Bee.
Like I mentioned before, it seems like Tobi is losing his " no feeling " mentality by the provocations of Naruto, and doesn't know how the handle the situation.
Is Madara going to stop Tobi just in time?? And how will he be there so fast?? It would be AWESOME if Madara simple just wharp himself to him ( we, as readers.. would be like: Naah, get the fuck out of here Madara.. on top of all that power, you have that wharping ability also?? )
And it seems like all those sharingan being collected by Tobi is one of the main force for casting the Infinite T-Yomi.. and not only Juubi. Lets be honest; Madara with Juubi next to him? Sasuke and Naruto needs to fight together for owning him, it has to be.
Besides: I also believe that those bijuu's gave Naruto their spiritual powers.. not for reviving another Juubi, but to cast all their abilities or in combination with Kurama's powers. It would be great if all those bijuu's gave something of So6P's power (like you've said), but that would contradict the fact of Rikudou splitting his powers and giving it to his sons, right??
That arua surrounding the Younger Son, is that the same thing when Naruto enters R- Mode?
I could be wrong but I'm going with the "Tobi-is-Madara's-left-over-soulless-body-augmented-with-hashirama's-cells-and-Tobi's-inquiring-of-Kabuto's-knowledge-of-the-Edo-Tensei-was-to-see-if-Kabuto-was-aware-of-Edo-Tense's-main-weakness;-forshadowing-Zombie-Madara's-future-escape" theory. :]
If Infinite Tsukuyomi requires the Juubi, and if Kabuto did tell Madara that this war was for the sake of collecting the Kyuubi, then it makes sense that Madara would go and fetch the Kyuubi as his first priority.
If Tobi is working for Madara, not himself, then Madara might let him live. But Madara could kill him either way, because he's Madara, respects no one, and is incredibly arrogant. So It's a coin Toss.
I think sasuke wants orochimaru to implant hashirama's cells into him, to evolve his EMS into Rinnegan
I find that quite the false statement. Madara gives respect where respect is due, hence his comments about Hashirama. What I'm trying to say, is that what seems like arrogant, isn't, it's simply an acknowledge of truth. Madara is a beast and a foreshadowing of Sasuke's power. It's a shame that we don't have a sufficient flashback of Madara's and Hashirama's fight.
Originally Posted by paulbee
I think Tobi seems quite accepting of his role within existence and was genuinely looking forward to resurrecting(or becoming complete since I still believe Tobi is Madara's body) Madara when the time was right, rather than eventually planning to betray Madara.
If Tobi is Madara's creation then it is unlikely he will betray Madara..... however he could be anybody else as well and that will make the plot much more interesting....!!
To me important thing is that Tobi has been after all tailed beasts but Madara has always been after nine tails.... is it because Madara also believe that Kurama is the most powerful of all the beasts as Kurama himself used to think ?
But still Tobi going for all the bijus can be a question mark over Tobi and Madara's connection.
About the cursed seal Madara might have.... i think it is very much likely... in fact not putting it on Madara's neck will be more unlike of Kabuto.
If Kabuto has put that seal on Madara then it could be all Kabuto's own plan and might have nothing to do with Oro and now Kabuto in Izanami that seal might work in favor of Madara.
It will be interesting to see how Sasuke meet Oro, either through cursed seal or perhaps Oro has some physical presence too weak though?
"Someone who knows all" could also refer to someone who knnows the answer of questions Sasuke asked himself i.e. What is a clan?, What is a Village?, What is a Shinobi?, What am I?....!! If that is the case then the that someone is Naruto...!!
And to meet Naruto Sasuke will perhaps gain a power up from Oro and then meet up with Naruto.... these questions could very well be ground work of Naruto's talk no jutsu vs Sasuke and Sasuke's way of enlightenment and redemption.
Let me clarify myself. The Only person Madara ever respected was Hashirama...Still he hated the guy. Madara is still an Arrogant Snot. Respecting the week and elderly is a virtue, but not to Madara.